• Trass3r (9/9) Jan 13 2011 I think the website layout should be rethought, couldn't even find the
• Don (7/18) Jan 13 2011 It used to contain several languages. It was removed due to intense
• spir (28/37) Jan 13 2011 That is fair. Such comparison tables always show the ref language to be
• Jesse Phillips (7/16) Jan 13 2011 Note that the site is eventually going to move to

Trass3r <un known.com> writes:

I think the website layout should be rethought, couldn't even find the
"Programming in D for C++ Programmers" page I wanted to show to a
workmate without an explicit search.

Imho it's important to have such comparison pages easily accessible
cause many people think "why should I learn yet another language, I'm
fine with C++/Java/whatever"

Also I don't understand why http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/
comparison.html only contains 1 column for D and no other languages so
you can directly see what they are all missing.

Don <nospam nospam.com> writes:

Trass3r wrote:
 I think the website layout should be rethought, couldn't even find the
 "Programming in D for C++ Programmers" page I wanted to show to a
 workmate without an explicit search.
 
 Imho it's important to have such comparison pages easily accessible
 cause many people think "why should I learn yet another language, I'm
 fine with C++/Java/whatever"
 
 Also I don't understand why http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/
 comparison.html only contains 1 column for D and no other languages so
 you can directly see what they are all missing.

It used to contain several languages. It was removed due to intense 
criticism. Basically, those kinds of lists are so subjective that all 
they do is cause offense. Especially when the list has colour coding 
green/red/yellow where green implicitly means 'good'.

There might be some value in a list of key design decisions, and list 
various languages as "same as D"/"different from D".

spir <denis.spir gmail.com> writes:

On 01/13/2011 11:15 AM, Don wrote:
 Also I don't understand why http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/
 comparison.html only contains 1 column for D and no other languages so
 you can directly see what they are all missing.

 It used to contain several languages. It was removed due to intense
 criticism. Basically, those kinds of lists are so subjective that all
 they do is cause offense. Especially when the list has colour coding
 green/red/yellow where green implicitly means 'good'.

That is fair. Such comparison tables always show the ref language to be 
the best one (possible)...
But what is not fair, strongly deceiving and even lying imo, is that 
docs & articles about D2, including comparisons, simply omit to mention 
the actual present state of the language. What we are constantly 
discussing in the mailing lists.

What about a thread listing D2 finished features, ones that really work 
fine already? (nice discussion expected about what "finished" means :-) 
and D1 features not disturbed by D2's evolution? Then post this on the 
website(s), with pointers from pages like the one evoked above.

I deeply think D would have a far better general image with accurate, 
*adult*, non-deceiving, non-lying, publicity. I bet more people 
interested in its intended design, features & evolution, would help in 
realising it, instead of turning back because of deception --not only 
because of its actual state.

Can you back the official website's "intro" page stating:
There are two versions of the language:
    1. D version 1 which is in maintenance mode.
    2. D version 2 which is recommended for new projects.
Also, keeping as first words: "D is a systems programming language.", 
simply diverts from D a fair amount of potential users.

 There might be some value in a list of key design decisions, and list
 various languages as "same as D"/"different from D".

+++ in the spirit of numerous TDPL passages
Design decisions (and non-features) often better define a language.

Denis
_________________
vita es estrany
spir.wikidot.com

Jesse Phillips <jessekphillips+D gmail.com> writes:

Trass3r Wrote:

 I think the website layout should be rethought, couldn't even find the
 "Programming in D for C++ Programmers" page I wanted to show to a
 workmate without an explicit search.

Note that the site is eventually going to move to

http://d-programming-language.org/

but that doesn't really help with this problem.

 Imho it's important to have such comparison pages easily accessible
 cause many people think "why should I learn yet another language, I'm
 fine with C++/Java/whatever"

I tried very hard to layout of the highly referenced Wiki4D so that information
like this was easy to find following links, and not to miss lead on the state
of the compiler.

http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?FrontPage

 Also I don't understand why http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/
 comparison.html only contains 1 column for D and no other languages so
 you can directly see what they are all missing.

You can find such a comparison:
http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?LanguagesVersusD