digitalmars.D - extern(Windows) behavior on non-Windows systems

Walter Bright (3/3) Jun 11 2014 I've got an enhancement request to have it behave like extern(C):

deadalnix (3/7) Jun 11 2014 What is the extern(Windows) is supposed to do differently on

Walter Bright (3/11) Jun 11 2014 It changes the calling convention and name mangling to match what Micros...

deadalnix (4/6) Jun 11 2014 OK, but I don't get why you wouldn't be able to use

Walter Bright (3/9) Jun 11 2014 http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/zxk0tw93.aspx

Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d (6/9) Jun 11 2014 I'd doubt there's be anyone that uses extern(Windows) on non-windows

Walter Bright (2/6) Jun 11 2014 Even Microsoft gave up on stdcall for Win64 and uses the C convention.

Adam D. Ruppe (4/6) Jun 11 2014 I think that's because the 64 bit C convention is a lot closer to

Walter Bright (5/9) Jun 11 2014 I just think that the purpose of having a separate Windows API calling

Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d (3/14) Jun 11 2014 Honestly, I'd first deprecate/remove extern(Pascal), then think about

FreeSlave (13/16) Jun 12 2014 I agree. Does anyone use extern(Pascal)? It's piece of old

Chris Williams (10/14) Jun 11 2014 No, but if I had a 3rd party .lib that had been built on Windows
Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d (6/9) Jun 11 2014 Regardless of what extern(Windows) is supposed to do on Windows systems,...
Kapps (4/8) Jun 11 2014 Isn't this the whole point of extern(System)? I don't really see
=?UTF-8?B?Ikx1w61z?= Marques" (15/19) Jun 12 2014 That example of "I want this calling convention on platform X and

Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:

I've got an enhancement request to have it behave like extern(C):

     https://issues.dlang.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12894

Thoughts? Anyone use extern(Windows) on non-Windows systems?

Jun 11 2014

"deadalnix" <deadalnix gmail.com> writes:

On Wednesday, 11 June 2014 at 22:20:27 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
 I've got an enhancement request to have it behave like 
 extern(C):

     https://issues.dlang.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12894

 Thoughts? Anyone use extern(Windows) on non-Windows systems?

What is the extern(Windows) is supposed to do differently on
windows than existing externs ?

Jun 11 2014

Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:

On 6/11/2014 3:24 PM, deadalnix wrote:
 On Wednesday, 11 June 2014 at 22:20:27 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
 I've got an enhancement request to have it behave like extern(C):

     https://issues.dlang.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12894

 Thoughts? Anyone use extern(Windows) on non-Windows systems?

 What is the extern(Windows) is supposed to do differently on
 windows than existing externs ?

It changes the calling convention and name mangling to match what Microsoft
uses 
for the Windows API.

Jun 11 2014

"deadalnix" <deadalnix gmail.com> writes:

On Wednesday, 11 June 2014 at 22:25:22 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
 It changes the calling convention and name mangling to match 
 what Microsoft uses for the Windows API.

OK, but I don't get why you wouldn't be able to use
extern(C/C++/Whatever) and it adapt to the system. Obviously
there is something about windows that I'm not really aware of.

Jun 11 2014

Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:

On 6/11/2014 3:27 PM, deadalnix wrote:
 On Wednesday, 11 June 2014 at 22:25:22 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
 It changes the calling convention and name mangling to match what Microsoft
 uses for the Windows API.

 OK, but I don't get why you wouldn't be able to use
 extern(C/C++/Whatever) and it adapt to the system.

That's what it does now.


 Obviously there is something about windows that I'm not really aware of.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/zxk0tw93.aspx

Jun 11 2014

Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> writes:

On 11 June 2014 23:20, Walter Bright via Digitalmars-d
<digitalmars-d puremagic.com> wrote:
 I've got an enhancement request to have it behave like extern(C):

     https://issues.dlang.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12894

 Thoughts? Anyone use extern(Windows) on non-Windows systems?

I'd doubt there's be anyone that uses extern(Windows) on non-windows
systems, but there may be people who wish to force stdcall for
whatever reason.  Currently, extern(C) on Windows could either be a
stdcall, cdecl or thiscall function.

Jun 11 2014

Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:

On 6/11/2014 4:17 PM, Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d wrote:
 I'd doubt there's be anyone that uses extern(Windows) on non-windows
 systems, but there may be people who wish to force stdcall for
 whatever reason.  Currently, extern(C) on Windows could either be a
 stdcall, cdecl or thiscall function.

Even Microsoft gave up on stdcall for Win64 and uses the C convention.

Jun 11 2014

"Adam D. Ruppe" <destructionator gmail.com> writes:

On Wednesday, 11 June 2014 at 23:27:09 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
 Even Microsoft gave up on stdcall for Win64 and uses the C 
 convention.

I think that's because the 64 bit C convention is a lot closer to 
the stdcall convention anyway, putting more args in registers 
etc...

Jun 11 2014

Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:

On 6/11/2014 4:34 PM, Adam D. Ruppe wrote:
 On Wednesday, 11 June 2014 at 23:27:09 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
 Even Microsoft gave up on stdcall for Win64 and uses the C convention.

 I think that's because the 64 bit C convention is a lot closer to the stdcall
 convention anyway, putting more args in registers etc...

I just think that the purpose of having a separate Windows API calling 
convention no longer makes any sense. It dates back to the 16 bit world when 
Pascal had a different calling convention and a lot of people thought that was 
better.

Jun 11 2014

Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> writes:

On 12 June 2014 00:17, Iain Buclaw <ibuclaw gdcproject.org> wrote:
 On 11 June 2014 23:20, Walter Bright via Digitalmars-d
 <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> wrote:
 I've got an enhancement request to have it behave like extern(C):

     https://issues.dlang.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12894

 Thoughts? Anyone use extern(Windows) on non-Windows systems?

 I'd doubt there's be anyone that uses extern(Windows) on non-windows
 systems, but there may be people who wish to force stdcall for
 whatever reason.  Currently, extern(C) on Windows could either be a
 stdcall, cdecl or thiscall function.

Honestly, I'd first deprecate/remove extern(Pascal), then think about
deprecating extern(Windows) later.

Jun 11 2014

"FreeSlave" <freeslave93 gmail.com> writes:

On Wednesday, 11 June 2014 at 23:19:43 UTC, Iain Buclaw via 
Digitalmars-d wrote:
 Honestly, I'd first deprecate/remove extern(Pascal), then think 
 about
 deprecating extern(Windows) later.

I agree. Does anyone use extern(Pascal)? It's piece of old 
history, and now it's more discouraging than useful, because it 
seems like the way to link D program with Pascal code, but today 
there are pascal compilers with incompatible mangling (just like 
C++ ones). For example, extern(Pascal) will not work with 
FreePascal as I recall.

And yes, there is extern(System) already for described purpose. 
It would be just weird to allow extern(Windows) work on 
non-Windows systems (just because of the name). Even if it can be 
useful by some reason, it needs to have another name 
(extern(Microsoft) or something).

Jun 12 2014

"Chris Williams" <yoreanon-chrisw yahoo.co.jp> writes:

On Wednesday, 11 June 2014 at 22:20:27 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
 I've got an enhancement request to have it behave like 
 extern(C):

     https://issues.dlang.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12894

 Thoughts? Anyone use extern(Windows) on non-Windows systems?

No, but if I had a 3rd party .lib that had been built on Windows
and it was the only known source for that library, I would prefer
to be able to convert it to a .a and link against it using
extern(Windows) (if possible).

I would vote that extern(Windows) should do what it says on the
tin OR issue an error telling people that a Mac/Linux build of
the compiler can't build binaries that have any chance of being
compatible with any library they'll ever find or make, so not to
include it as a build target.

Jun 11 2014

Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> writes:

On Wed, 11 Jun 2014 15:20:29 -0700
Walter Bright via Digitalmars-d <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> wrote:

 I've got an enhancement request to have it behave like extern(C):

      https://issues.dlang.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12894

 Thoughts? Anyone use extern(Windows) on non-Windows systems?

Regardless of what extern(Windows) is supposed to do on Windows systems, it
seems _very_ broken to me to have it even compile on non-Windows systems. If
you want it to work across OSes, that's what extern(System) is for.

- Jonathan M Davis

Jun 11 2014

"Kapps" <opantm2+spam gmail.com> writes:

On Wednesday, 11 June 2014 at 22:20:27 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
 I've got an enhancement request to have it behave like 
 extern(C):

     https://issues.dlang.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12894

 Thoughts? Anyone use extern(Windows) on non-Windows systems?

Isn't this the whole point of extern(System)? I don't really see 
the benefit, and don't think that extern(Windows) should even 
compile on non-Windows platforms.

Jun 11 2014

=?UTF-8?B?Ikx1w61z?= Marques" <luis luismarques.eu> writes:

On Wednesday, 11 June 2014 at 22:20:27 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
 I've got an enhancement request to have it behave like 
 extern(C):

     https://issues.dlang.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12894

 Thoughts? Anyone use extern(Windows) on non-Windows systems?

That example of "I want this calling convention on platform X and 
that other convention on platform Y" points to the deeper problem 
that (without a preprocessor) you can't do something like this in 
D:

     version(Windows)
         alias extern(Foo) = extern(Windows);
     else
         alias extern(Foo) = extern(C);

     extern(Foo):
         void foobar();
         int baz();

That reasoning also applies to various other attributes. IMO, 
repeating all of the declarations for the multiple variants you 
might want is not the right answer (DRY principle, etc.).

Jun 12 2014

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digitalmars.D - extern(Windows) behavior on non-Windows systems