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digitalmars.D.announce - DMDScript now on D2

reply Dmitry Olshansky <dmitry.olsh gmail.com> writes:
Following that quite emotional discussion of JavaScript on  
digitalmars.D I decided I'll take a risk to announce my work on porting 
DMDScript, that is ECMA-262 script engine.

In the end it turned out to more like a quite successful fork given the 
amount of changes. The goal was not only to just make it compile with D2 
and work (that would be of limited value) but also slowly convert it to 
newer D2 idioms/libraries/etc, I essence simplifying user side code  for 
writing extensions. For instance, I even managed to use immutable 
strings throughout, at the expense of a couple of casts at critical spots.

I'm considering current state of release as stable beta, since I had to 
disable some of original performance tricks in order to debug some 
issues properly. They eventually would be re-enabled of course.
Latest tar with source code + samples can be found here: 
http://dsource.org/projects/dmdscript-2/browser/downloads

Things of possible interest:
-- Builds & fully works with latest dmd , tested on Windows and Linux
-- Greatly increased standard conformance
-- Still runs quite fast
-- Some huge bugs fixed, that were present in DMDScript 1.16 . (for 
instance 'in' _expression_ not implemented)
-- Includes (highly experimental)  module for extending script engine 
with native D functions/types in a couple of LOCs
-- Contains few basic examples to get started

P.S. I'm still reluctant to give it a version number, should it be 
DMDScript2 0.1 ?

-- 
Dmitry Olshansky
Dec 16 2010
next sibling parent reply Adam Ruppe <destructionator gmail.com> writes:
Dmitry Olshansky wrote:

 The goal was not only to just make it compile with D2
 and work (that would be of limited value)


I tried this too about a year ago...:
http://arsdnet.net/dcode/dmdscript_d2.zip

...but overall, from a brief glance, your port is *much* better
than mine. I used a lot more casts and idups, and thus introduced
new bugs and hurt the performance. I got it working, but not working
well.

Nice work!

But there still might be a few ideas or bits of code
we can share from the easy expansion stuff.

I called mine "pretty.d" and "test.d" in that zip. One of the
things I tried to do was make a ScriptObject class in D, which
you could expand and call with opIndex and opDispatch.

I was only partially successful, but maybe we can better with
a newer compiler.

Here's a copy/paste of part of my test.d showing the idea I was chasing:

=======
        auto g = se.globalObject; // se is a ScriptEngine

        /* You can work with the script environment as an associative
array... */
        g["hello"] = "Hello, world!";
        g["lol"] = new ScriptObject; // ScriptObject is just a generic object.
You can specialize it in the constructor.
        //g["lol"]["fun"] = &fun; // Can even assign native top-level functions
this way!  FIXME: broken due to ICE

        /* Or, you can do it with opDispatch, though this is limited to just
assigning existing ScriptObjects... */
        auto so2 = new ScriptObject;
        se.globalObject.lol.hate = so2;

        /* You can also add functions to specific ScriptObjects with the
addFunction template */
        se.addFunction!(raise, "fun")(so2);

=======

And all that stuff would of course be available to the script via
the global object.

In pretty.d, you can see some attempt to unify D and dmdscript
exceptions too, but I don't recall how well that went, but I'm
pretty sure it worked at least one way.


One little thing we both did is one line expansion. One thing I'd
add to your code is making the name of the script function default
to being the same name as the D function. It's a minor addition,
but I think it looks nice.


Generally though, your port is excellent, thanks for doing it!
Dec 16 2010
parent Dmitry Olshansky <dmitry.olsh gmail.com> writes:
On 16.12.2010 19:43, Adam Ruppe wrote:

 Dmitry Olshansky wrote:

 The goal was not only to just make it compile with D2
 and work (that would be of limited value)


 I tried this too about a year ago...:
 http://arsdnet.net/dcode/dmdscript_d2.zip


Yes, that's the only previous effort I've found, and  it was after my 
port almost started working.


 ...but overall, from a brief glance, your port is *much* better
 than mine. I used a lot more casts and idups, and thus introduced
 new bugs and hurt the performance. I got it working, but not working
 well.

 Nice work!


Thanks, yet I plan a lot of refactoring, one I dream of is eventually 
replacing struct Value with Algebraic from Phobos. And yes, that 
exception propagation mechanism, I almost switched to throwing instead 
of returning exceptions from functions.

 But there still might be a few ideas or bits of code
 we can share from the easy expansion stuff.

 I called mine "pretty.d" and "test.d" in that zip. One of the
 things I tried to do was make a ScriptObject class in D, which
 you could expand and call with opIndex and opDispatch.

 I was only partially successful, but maybe we can better with
 a newer compiler.

 Here's a copy/paste of part of my test.d showing the idea I was chasing:

 =======
          auto g = se.globalObject; // se is a ScriptEngine

          /* You can work with the script environment as an associative
 array... */
          g["hello"] = "Hello, world!";
          g["lol"] = new ScriptObject; // ScriptObject is just a generic object.
 You can specialize it in the constructor.
          //g["lol"]["fun"] =&fun; // Can even assign native top-level functions
 this way!  FIXME: broken due to ICE

          /* Or, you can do it with opDispatch, though this is limited to just
 assigning existing ScriptObjects... */
          auto so2 = new ScriptObject;
          se.globalObject.lol.hate = so2;

          /* You can also add functions to specific ScriptObjects with the
 addFunction template */
          se.addFunction!(raise, "fun")(so2);

 =======


Yes, that's awesome. I guess I should get a closer look at that pretty.d!

 And all that stuff would of course be available to the script via
 the global object.

 In pretty.d, you can see some attempt to unify D and dmdscript
 exceptions too, but I don't recall how well that went, but I'm
 pretty sure it worked at least one way.


 One little thing we both did is one line expansion. One thing I'd
 add to your code is making the name of the script function default
 to being the same name as the D function. It's a minor addition,
 but I think it looks nice.


Yes, it's planned, and indeed improves user experience. I just was stuck 
with the issue of extending of variadic functions/templated functions 
consider, for example, std.stdio.writeln.  That must have distracted me 
from this issue.


 Generally though, your port is excellent, thanks for doing it!


-- 

Dmitry Olshansky
Dec 16 2010
prev sibling parent reply Brian Hay <bhay construct3d.com> writes:
On 17/12/2010 2:14 AM, Dmitry Olshansky wrote:

 I decided I'll take a risk to announce my work on porting DMDScript,
 that is ECMA-262 script engine.


Nice!

As few seem to read the DMDScript newsgroup, here's my last post as it 
seems relevant to this topic.

===================================

There's a JavaScript arms race going on (as I'm sure many of you are 
aware). The competing JS engines of the major browsers are leap-frogging 
each other in performance every few months it seems.

http://www.conceivablytech.com/4472/products/chrome-10-posts-huge-performance-jump/

It would be so cool (and a huge showcase for the D Programming Language) 
if DMDScript was in that performance race and beating the big guns.

Possible?
Dec 16 2010
next sibling parent reply "Nick Sabalausky" <a a.a> writes:
"Brian Hay" <bhay construct3d.com> wrote in message 
news:ieecsp$1ej5$1 digitalmars.com...

 On 17/12/2010 2:14 AM, Dmitry Olshansky wrote:

 I decided I'll take a risk to announce my work on porting DMDScript,
 that is ECMA-262 script engine.


 Nice!

 As few seem to read the DMDScript newsgroup, here's my last post as it 
 seems relevant to this topic.

 ===================================

 There's a JavaScript arms race going on (as I'm sure many of you are 
 aware). The competing JS engines of the major browsers are leap-frogging 
 each other in performance every few months it seems.

 http://www.conceivablytech.com/4472/products/chrome-10-posts-huge-performance-jump/

 It would be so cool (and a huge showcase for the D Programming Language) 
 if DMDScript was in that performance race and beating the big guns.

 Possible?


First step, of course, would be to run those benchmarks on DMDScript. Though 
everyone probably knows I'm a rather vocal anti-fan of JS, even I'd be very 
interested to see how DMDScript currently stacks up to the rest. I'd laugh 
my ass off if after all this time of not a whole lot of work on DMDScript 
besides the port to D2 (unless I'm mistaken), if it still managed to be on 
par with or beat all those others that have been pounding their chests and 
bashing each other over the head.
Dec 16 2010
parent reply Brian Hay <bhay construct3d.com> writes:
On 17/12/2010 12:00 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:

 "Brian Hay"<bhay construct3d.com>  wrote in message
 news:ieecsp$1ej5$1 digitalmars.com...

 On 17/12/2010 2:14 AM, Dmitry Olshansky wrote:

 I decided I'll take a risk to announce my work on porting DMDScript,
 that is ECMA-262 script engine.


 Nice!

 As few seem to read the DMDScript newsgroup, here's my last post as it
 seems relevant to this topic.

 ===================================

 There's a JavaScript arms race going on (as I'm sure many of you are
 aware). The competing JS engines of the major browsers are leap-frogging
 each other in performance every few months it seems.

 http://www.conceivablytech.com/4472/products/chrome-10-posts-huge-performance-jump/

 It would be so cool (and a huge showcase for the D Programming Language)
 if DMDScript was in that performance race and beating the big guns.

 Possible?


 First step, of course, would be to run those benchmarks on DMDScript. Though
 everyone probably knows I'm a rather vocal anti-fan of JS, even I'd be very
 interested to see how DMDScript currently stacks up to the rest. I'd laugh
 my ass off if after all this time of not a whole lot of work on DMDScript
 besides the port to D2 (unless I'm mistaken), if it still managed to be on
 par with or beat all those others that have been pounding their chests and
 bashing each other over the head.


Like it or not, javascript is THE programming language of the 
client-side web (rich web apps, Google maps, docs, Flash ActionScript, 
X3D etc etc), so to be in that arms race would be a huge boon to the D 
Programming Language IMHO.

Agreed, DMDScript is unlikely to be competitive with compiled JS engines 
like V8 and spidermonkey now, but we won't know until it's benchmarked 
and possibly some of the performance enhancements that went into those 
engines can be adapted for dmdscript (although I don't know the first 
thing about interpreter or compiler writing, so I'm just speculating).
Dec 16 2010
parent "Nick Sabalausky" <a a.a> writes:
"Brian Hay" <bhay construct3d.com> wrote in message 
news:ieehug$1q5s$1 digitalmars.com...

 On 17/12/2010 12:00 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:

 "Brian Hay"<bhay construct3d.com>  wrote in message
 news:ieecsp$1ej5$1 digitalmars.com...

 On 17/12/2010 2:14 AM, Dmitry Olshansky wrote:

 I decided I'll take a risk to announce my work on porting DMDScript,
 that is ECMA-262 script engine.


 Nice!

 As few seem to read the DMDScript newsgroup, here's my last post as it
 seems relevant to this topic.

 ===================================

 There's a JavaScript arms race going on (as I'm sure many of you are
 aware). The competing JS engines of the major browsers are leap-frogging
 each other in performance every few months it seems.

 http://www.conceivablytech.com/4472/products/chrome-10-posts-huge-performance-jump/

 It would be so cool (and a huge showcase for the D Programming Language)
 if DMDScript was in that performance race and beating the big guns.

 Possible?


 First step, of course, would be to run those benchmarks on DMDScript. 
 Though
 everyone probably knows I'm a rather vocal anti-fan of JS, even I'd be 
 very
 interested to see how DMDScript currently stacks up to the rest. I'd 
 laugh
 my ass off if after all this time of not a whole lot of work on DMDScript
 besides the port to D2 (unless I'm mistaken), if it still managed to be 
 on
 par with or beat all those others that have been pounding their chests 
 and
 bashing each other over the head.


 Like it or not, javascript is THE programming language of the client-side 
 web (rich web apps, Google maps, docs, Flash ActionScript, X3D etc etc), 
 so to be in that arms race would be a huge boon to the D Programming 
 Language IMHO.


Agreed. I can at least see the writing on the wall even if I don't like what 
it says ;)

Although in the case of Flash, I've been using Haxe which compiles directly 
to Flash bytecode. I think there may be some intermediate ActionScript 
needed for a few things if you're doing strictly Flash9+, but the 
combination of Haxe and some custom tools/libs I've made have been enough to 
paper over enough of the usual drawbacks of maintaining Flash8/Wii 
compatibility.


 Agreed, DMDScript is unlikely to be competitive with compiled JS engines 
 like V8 and spidermonkey now, but we won't know until it's benchmarked and 
 possibly some of the performance enhancements that went into those engines 
 can be adapted for dmdscript (although I don't know the first thing about 
 interpreter or compiler writing, so I'm just speculating).


Yea. It would also be really interesting to see how much work would really 
be needed to bring it back up to par with the latest competition. Being able 
to get up the that really easily would be a nice bragging right for D. :)
Dec 16 2010
prev sibling next sibling parent reply Adam D. Ruppe <destructionator gmail.com> writes:
Brian Hay wrote:

 It would be so cool (and a huge showcase for the D Programming Language)
if DMDScript was in that performance race and beating the big guns.


It kicked the living crap out of the competition up to not too long ago! It beat
out Firefox 2 by well about 50x when I checked it, and IE7 by IIRC 20x.

What's really impressive is dmdscript was several years old at
that point - as in it only got a few minor bugfixes in those years,
and the main design was even older. It took the big guys some
five years or more to catch up to lone Walter.


It was about 1/2 the speed of Firefox 3 when I checked it last. That
gap has probably widened quite a bit in the last year. A quick check using the
sieve.ds shows Firefox 3 is currently about 16x faster than dmdscript.

The gap is definitely opening up in the other direction now, but
still, it took them long enough!



Could dmdscript take the lead back? Probably, though I suspect it'd
be quite a lot of work. But I don't really know. dmdscript is a kind of
compiler,
so maybe not. I'm just not qualified.
Dec 16 2010
parent Dmitry Olshansky <dmitry.olsh gmail.com> writes:
On 17.12.2010 5:34, Adam D. Ruppe wrote:

 Brian Hay wrote:

 It would be so cool (and a huge showcase for the D Programming Language)
 if DMDScript was in that performance race and beating the big guns.


 It kicked the living crap out of the competition up to not too long ago! It
beat
 out Firefox 2 by well about 50x when I checked it, and IE7 by IIRC 20x.

 What's really impressive is dmdscript was several years old at
 that point - as in it only got a few minor bugfixes in those years,
 and the main design was even older. It took the big guys some
 five years or more to catch up to lone Walter.


 It was about 1/2 the speed of Firefox 3 when I checked it last. That
 gap has probably widened quite a bit in the last year. A quick check using the
 sieve.ds shows Firefox 3 is currently about 16x faster than dmdscript.


Yes, it's about 20x times slower on my machine..
It must be the properties of RandAA, namely relatively slow lookup time. 
Profiler shows 90% time is spent in hashmap lookup function. I had to 
replace built-in AA at certain point because of spurious segfaults that 
fixed, but must have degraded speed.


 The gap is definitely opening up in the other direction now, but
 still, it took them long enough!



 Could dmdscript take the lead back? Probably, though I suspect it'd
 be quite a lot of work. But I don't really know. dmdscript is a kind of
compiler,
 so maybe not. I'm just not qualified.



-- 
Dmitry Olshansky
Dec 17 2010
prev sibling parent Dmitry Olshansky <dmitry.olsh gmail.com> writes:
On 17.12.2010 4:01, Brian Hay wrote:

 On 17/12/2010 2:14 AM, Dmitry Olshansky wrote:

 I decided I'll take a risk to announce my work on porting DMDScript,
 that is ECMA-262 script engine.


 Nice!

 As few seem to read the DMDScript newsgroup, here's my last post as it 
 seems relevant to this topic.

 ===================================

 There's a JavaScript arms race going on (as I'm sure many of you are 
 aware). The competing JS engines of the major browsers are 
 leap-frogging each other in performance every few months it seems.

 http://www.conceivablytech.com/4472/products/chrome-10-posts-hu
e-performance-jump/ 


 It would be so cool (and a huge showcase for the D Programming 
 Language) if DMDScript was in that performance race and beating the 
 big guns.

 Possible?


Indeed, that would be desirable.
I dreamed to get back performance tuning  from the day it started 
working, but It's better to fix some bugs and clean up the source first.

-- 
Dmitry Olshansky
Dec 17 2010