• Orgoton (1/1) Mar 02 2007 Does DMD perform processor specific optimizations? Does it make use of M...
• janderson (6/7) Mar 02 2007 Not at the moment (as far as I know), although there have been some long...
• Howard Berkey (2/12) Mar 02 2007 I was thinking that some kind of standardized vector intrinsic interface...
• Daniel Keep (14/29) Mar 02 2007 Some time ago, I wrote a simple library that extended arrays of basic
• Howard Berkey (10/40) Mar 03 2007 My fear is that the SIMD operations themselves might not be orthogonal e...
• Benji Smith (8/12) Mar 03 2007 Please do publish it. I'd like to teach myself some assembly
• Daniel Keep (25/41) Mar 06 2007 Tracked it down, zipped it up, and attached it. However, keep in mind
• Daniel Keep (8/8) Mar 06 2007 Hmm... forgot to attach it. I tried uploading to my web-space, but it
• Benji Smith (3/5) Mar 06 2007 Thanks!!!
• Stewart Gordon (5/7) Mar 04 2007 At first I thought that was a new means of munging email addresses. Now...
• =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jari-Matti_M=E4kel=E4?= (3/12) Mar 04 2007 A true hacker probably automagically decodes it. :) The program on the
• Daniel Keep (9/20) Mar 04 2007 I did write a Python script that would decode it, but that was ages ago
• Dan (2/2) Mar 05 2007 Sweet. That's actually rather terse, and interesting...
• Dan (4/4) Mar 05 2007 Dan Wrote:
• Stewart Gordon (4/4) Mar 06 2007 Two other interesting observations.

Orgoton <orgoton mindless.com> writes:

Does DMD perform processor specific optimizations? Does it make use of MMX, SSE
and other such extensions? I am creating high performance applications and
these optimizations would really come in handy.

janderson <askme me.com> writes:

Orgoton wrote:
 Does DMD perform processor specific optimizations? Does it make use of MMX,
SSE and other such extensions? I am creating high performance applications and
these optimizations would really come in handy.

Not at the moment (as far as I know), although there have been some long 
discussions about it.  Of course you can always do it in ASM. 
Performance wise, you should be able to get near or better then C++.

PS - I'm looking forward to seeing these in D as well.

-Joel

Howard Berkey <howard well.com> writes:

janderson Wrote:

 Orgoton wrote:
 Does DMD perform processor specific optimizations? Does it make use of MMX,
SSE and other such extensions? I am creating high performance applications and
these optimizations would really come in handy.

 
 Not at the moment (as far as I know), although there have been some long 
 discussions about it.  Of course you can always do it in ASM. 
 Performance wise, you should be able to get near or better then C++.
 
 PS - I'm looking forward to seeing these in D as well.
 
 -Joel


I was thinking that some kind of standardized vector intrinsic interface would
be really cool.  Think std.intrinsic or Tango's core.intrinsic, extended to
vectorized types, with one interface for various underlying implementations.  I
don't know enough about the functional overlap of AltiVec with x86 SIMD to know
if it is feasible or not though, especially if things like alignment contraints
are different for each set.

Daniel Keep <daniel.keep.lists gmail.com> writes:

Howard Berkey wrote:
 janderson Wrote:
 
 Orgoton wrote:
 Does DMD perform processor specific optimizations? Does it make use of MMX,
SSE and other such extensions? I am creating high performance applications and
these optimizations would really come in handy.

 Not at the moment (as far as I know), although there have been some long 
 discussions about it.  Of course you can always do it in ASM. 
 Performance wise, you should be able to get near or better then C++.

 PS - I'm looking forward to seeing these in D as well.

 -Joel

 
 
 I was thinking that some kind of standardized vector intrinsic interface would
be really cool.  Think std.intrinsic or Tango's core.intrinsic, extended to
vectorized types, with one interface for various underlying implementations.  I
don't know enough about the functional overlap of AltiVec with x86 SIMD to know
if it is feasible or not though, especially if things like alignment contraints
are different for each set.
 

Some time ago, I wrote a simple library that extended arrays of basic
types with parallel operations (like add, mult, madd, etc.) that were
coded in MMX.  Never bothered to publish it since I wasn't sure if it
was actually useful or not...

That said, it's certainly possible to add some of this stuff in library
code.  It's definitely worth doing it if only because you need to teach
yourself some assembler to do it.

	-- Daniel

-- 
Unlike Knuth, I have neither proven or tried the above; it may not even
make sense.

v2sw5+8Yhw5ln4+5pr6OFPma8u6+7Lw4Tm6+7l6+7D
i28a2Xs3MSr2e4/6+7t4TNSMb6HTOp5en5g6RAHCP  http://hackerkey.com/

Howard Berkey <howard well.com> writes:

Daniel Keep Wrote:

 
 
 Howard Berkey wrote:
 janderson Wrote:
 
 Orgoton wrote:
 Does DMD perform processor specific optimizations? Does it make use of MMX,
SSE and other such extensions? I am creating high performance applications and
these optimizations would really come in handy.

 Not at the moment (as far as I know), although there have been some long 
 discussions about it.  Of course you can always do it in ASM. 
 Performance wise, you should be able to get near or better then C++.

 PS - I'm looking forward to seeing these in D as well.

 -Joel

 
 
 I was thinking that some kind of standardized vector intrinsic interface would
be really cool.  Think std.intrinsic or Tango's core.intrinsic, extended to
vectorized types, with one interface for various underlying implementations.  I
don't know enough about the functional overlap of AltiVec with x86 SIMD to know
if it is feasible or not though, especially if things like alignment contraints
are different for each set.
 

 
 Some time ago, I wrote a simple library that extended arrays of basic
 types with parallel operations (like add, mult, madd, etc.) that were
 coded in MMX.  Never bothered to publish it since I wasn't sure if it
 was actually useful or not...
 
 That said, it's certainly possible to add some of this stuff in library
 code.  It's definitely worth doing it if only because you need to teach
 yourself some assembler to do it.
 
 	-- Daniel
 

My fear is that the SIMD operations themselves might not be orthogonal enough
across various processors to be able to abstract anything but a small subset in
a standardized way in a platform library like phobos or Tango.  I have not
really looked in to them enough to know; this is just something that I am kind
of tangentially interested in and I thought it would be cool if possible.

The other option of course is to have the compiler generate and use them
internally when possible.  And of course the two options are not mutually
exclusive either.

I think that D has a really good start on this now; having things like
std.intrinsic in the standard librar(ies) is actually very nice.  Having
alignment as a specifier baked into the language itself is also great; no more
ugly compiler specific stuff like

#ifdef __GNUC__
__attribute__((aligned(16)));
#endif

or whatever.

But I digress from the original question :)

Howard

Benji Smith <dlanguage benjismith.net> writes:

Daniel Keep wrote:
 Some time ago, I wrote a simple library that extended arrays of basic
 types with parallel operations (like add, mult, madd, etc.) that were
 coded in MMX.  Never bothered to publish it since I wasn't sure if it
 was actually useful or not...

Please do publish it. I'd like to teach myself some assembly 
programming, and it'd be nice to see someone else's code for inlining 
array operations with MMX instructions.

If you don't post it at dsource, at least send me an email with the code 
attached.

Thanks!!

--benji

Daniel Keep <daniel.keep.lists gmail.com> writes:

Benji Smith wrote:
 Daniel Keep wrote:
 Some time ago, I wrote a simple library that extended arrays of basic
 types with parallel operations (like add, mult, madd, etc.) that were
 coded in MMX.  Never bothered to publish it since I wasn't sure if it
 was actually useful or not...

 
 Please do publish it. I'd like to teach myself some assembly
 programming, and it'd be nice to see someone else's code for inlining
 array operations with MMX instructions.
 
 If you don't post it at dsource, at least send me an email with the code
 attached.
 
 Thanks!!
 
 --benji

Tracked it down, zipped it up, and attached it.  However, keep in mind
that this code is almost a year old, not extensively tested, and *very
likely* won't compile.  If you actually want to get it working, I
suggest looking for implicit conversions from arrays to pointers and
public/private import problems (default changed from public to private).

I actually liked how this library was put together, even if it *was*
fairly useless.  At compile time, it selected one of a set of backends
depending on version flags and what platform you were on.  If your
platform didn't have a fast parallel implementation available, it simply
fell back on the software implementation.  Code once, run anywhere, run
really fast where possible :P

Anyway, the assembler code should still work.  I don't think it's all
been very thoroughly tested, and there could be other errors or
problems.  But it might make a nice starting point.

Incidentally, all of the code is public domain, so if anyone wants to
take this and run with it, feel free.  If anyone on the Tango project is
interested, I'd still like to see something like this in Tango (or
Phobos!) at some stage (better designed, I would hope).

	-- Daniel

-- 
Unlike Knuth, I have neither proven or tried the above; it may not even
make sense.

v2sw5+8Yhw5ln4+5pr6OFPma8u6+7Lw4Tm6+7l6+7D
i28a2Xs3MSr2e4/6+7t4TNSMb6HTOp5en5g6RAHCP  http://hackerkey.com/

Daniel Keep <daniel.keep.lists gmail.com> writes:

Hmm... forgot to attach it.  I tried uploading to my web-space, but it
looks like the ISP's decided to not publish user directories anymore :'(

	-- Daniel

-- 
Unlike Knuth, I have neither proven or tried the above; it may not even
make sense.

v2sw5+8Yhw5ln4+5pr6OFPma8u6+7Lw4Tm6+7l6+7D
i28a2Xs3MSr2e4/6+7t4TNSMb6HTOp5en5g6RAHCP  http://hackerkey.com/

Benji Smith <dlanguage benjismith.net> writes:

Daniel Keep wrote:
 Hmm... forgot to attach it.  I tried uploading to my web-space, but it
 looks like the ISP's decided to not publish user directories anymore :'(

Thanks!!!

--benji

Stewart Gordon <smjg_1998 yahoo.com> writes:

Daniel Keep Wrote:

<snip>
 v2sw5+8Yhw5ln4+5pr6OFPma8u6+7Lw4Tm6+7l6+7D
 i28a2Xs3MSr2e4/6+7t4TNSMb6HTOp5en5g6RAHCP  http://hackerkey.com/

At first I thought that was a new means of munging email addresses.  Now I see
it's a new version of geek code.

But is there any tool for decoding the version you've used, or is one supposed
to do it manually?

Stewart.

=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jari-Matti_M=E4kel=E4?= <jmjmak utu.fi.invalid> writes:

Stewart Gordon kirjoitti:
 Daniel Keep Wrote:
 
 <snip>
 v2sw5+8Yhw5ln4+5pr6OFPma8u6+7Lw4Tm6+7l6+7D
 i28a2Xs3MSr2e4/6+7t4TNSMb6HTOp5en5g6RAHCP  http://hackerkey.com/

 
 At first I thought that was a new means of munging email addresses.  Now I see
it's a new version of geek code.
 
 But is there any tool for decoding the version you've used, or is one supposed
to do it manually?

A true hacker probably automagically decodes it. :) The program on the
website happily decrypts it after replacing v2 with v4.

Daniel Keep <daniel.keep.lists gmail.com> writes:

Stewart Gordon wrote:
 Daniel Keep Wrote:
 
 <snip>
 v2sw5+8Yhw5ln4+5pr6OFPma8u6+7Lw4Tm6+7l6+7D
 i28a2Xs3MSr2e4/6+7t4TNSMb6HTOp5en5g6RAHCP  http://hackerkey.com/

 
 At first I thought that was a new means of munging email addresses.  Now I see
it's a new version of geek code.
 
 But is there any tool for decoding the version you've used, or is one supposed
to do it manually?
 
 Stewart.

I did write a Python script that would decode it, but that was ages ago
and stuffed if I can find the damn thing...

	-- Daniel

-- 
Unlike Knuth, I have neither proven or tried the above; it may not even
make sense.

v2sw5+8Yhw5ln4+5pr6OFPma8u6+7Lw4Tm6+7l6+7D
i28a2Xs3MSr2e4/6+7t4TNSMb6HTOp5en5g6RAHCP  http://hackerkey.com/

Dan <murpsoft hotmail.com> writes:

Sweet.  That's actually rather terse, and interesting...

sw7CSDhw5ln7pr7OSAPFck2ma5u6LSBw4Xl6GLSiOSciTE/e4t3b6AHen4g5VGPa2Xs6MRr8p-2/-5
hackerkey.com

Dan <murpsoft hotmail.com> writes:

Dan Wrote:

They have a generator, good.  The one I just wrote up had bugs and missing
features.  : p

Here we are:
v4sw7+8CHSUhw5ln7pr7AFOPS$ck2ma5+8u6+7LOSw4Xm3l6GKLSiOSciTE/e4t3b6ADHen4a
Xs6/8MRr8p-2/-5g5GV hackerkey.com

Stewart Gordon <smjg_1998 yahoo.com> writes:

Two other interesting observations.

1. "Keep the Guide up to date.  I can only promise I will either keep the guide
up to date or turn it over to someone who will.   Time will tell if I can keep
that promise."  It took me a while to notice that it was talking about keeping
the Guide up to date, not keeping Hacker Key itself up to date (which it
already isn't).

2. It isn't clear how they're making commercial use of the Hacker Key or even
planning to.

Stewart.