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digitalmars.D - [OT] D's community is awesome!

reply "Nick Sabalausky" <a a.a> writes:
Seriously. You have a problem with something D-related? D-people are 
helpful, friendly and articulate.

By contrast, I once again tried to get TortoiseHg/hg-git working with 
github. TortoiseHg's homepage has a big prominent "download latest installer 
for your OS" button (but worded better than that ;) ). It includes hg-git, 
mercurial, dulwich, all the requirements built right in with a nice 
installer. Great, right? Except a simple "clone from github, modify, commit, 
push" didn't work (just like it never did before). This time it was a little 
bit different, though. Something about not being "head", and something else 
about bookmarks. Blah, blah, etc.

That's all fine, of course. I can understand bugs getting in now and then, 
and even taking a little while to get sorted out, especially on a big major 
OSS project. So I filed a bug report.

Now here's where the D world really shines: If this had been within the D 
sphere of influence, the response would most likely have been helpful, 
meaningful, friendly, you know, *good*. But with this, the response I got 
was three lower-cased, non-punctuated words: "update your extensions" 
...WTF? Yea, way to be helpful. Thanks for nothing. At least it wasn't 
"RTFM" - whoever coinded that one seriously needs to be shot.

But from my (admittedly still limited) experience, that sort of thing seems 
to be typical of places like BitBucket and Launchpad (I've had worse on 
Launchpad before, regarding Ubuntu: Ubuntu has a long-standing tradition of 
screwing up the screen resolution if you boot with your monitor off. But 
instead of doing anything sensible about it, like, say, marking it as 
Triaged at Low Priority and accepting that the problem even exists, it works 
like this: You post on the existing open report for it, and they scold you 
for using custom drivers. You point out that you get the same problem 
*without* using the custom drivers, and they insist you need to open a new 
report "because your configuration is different than the OP". Ok, but 
there's about ten other reports (from other people who also had a different 
configuration) that did *exactly that*, which were promptly closed for being 
duplicates. WTF?!?)

Anyway, I don't actually care about this issue anymore, and I'm not posting 
here looking for help on it. I dislike Git/TortoiseGit, but at least I can 
get by with them, whereas I've pretty much concluded at this point that 
hg-git just isn't worth bothering with.

But the point is, I really appreciate how awesome the D community is 
compared to so many others.
Jun 09 2011
next sibling parent Bernard Helyer <b.helyer gmail.com> writes:
Lurk moar, noob
Jun 10 2011
prev sibling parent reply Robert Clipsham <robert octarineparrot.com> writes:
On 10/06/2011 07:27, Nick Sabalausky wrote:

 Seriously. You have a problem with something D-related? D-people are
 helpful, friendly and articulate.


For the most part, there'll always be people in the community who 
aren't. Just like every community gets a troll or two.


 By contrast, I once again tried to get TortoiseHg/hg-git working with
 github. TortoiseHg's homepage has a big prominent "download latest installer
 for your OS" button (but worded better than that ;) ). It includes hg-git,
 mercurial, dulwich, all the requirements built right in with a nice
 installer. Great, right? Except a simple "clone from github, modify, commit,
 push" didn't work (just like it never did before). This time it was a little
 bit different, though. Something about not being "head", and something else
 about bookmarks. Blah, blah, etc.

 That's all fine, of course. I can understand bugs getting in now and then,
 and even taking a little while to get sorted out, especially on a big major
 OSS project. So I filed a bug report.

 Now here's where the D world really shines: If this had been within the D
 sphere of influence, the response would most likely have been helpful,
 meaningful, friendly, you know, *good*. But with this, the response I got
 was three lower-cased, non-punctuated words: "update your extensions"
 ...WTF? Yea, way to be helpful. Thanks for nothing. At least it wasn't
 "RTFM" - whoever coinded that one seriously needs to be shot.


I find the people that tend to give these responses are people that are 
used to dealing with bug reports from users rather than developers - 
after a while you begin to drop the pleasantries because you're so used 
to giving a standard response which sorts it most of the time. Of 
course, this rather defeats the point of a bug tracker in my opinion.


 But from my (admittedly still limited) experience, that sort of thing seems
 to be typical of places like BitBucket and Launchpad (I've had worse on
 Launchpad before, regarding Ubuntu: Ubuntu has a long-standing tradition of
 screwing up the screen resolution if you boot with your monitor off. But
 instead of doing anything sensible about it, like, say, marking it as
 Triaged at Low Priority and accepting that the problem even exists, it works
 like this: You post on the existing open report for it, and they scold you
 for using custom drivers. You point out that you get the same problem
 *without* using the custom drivers, and they insist you need to open a new
 report "because your configuration is different than the OP". Ok, but
 there's about ten other reports (from other people who also had a different
 configuration) that did *exactly that*, which were promptly closed for being
 duplicates. WTF?!?)


It's unfortunate you've encountered such responses - I've not had a bad 
experience with any bitbucket project, launchpad was slightly different, 
but it was nothing terrible. With the github decentralized model I think 
it makes it even less likely, there's a far stronger community thanks to 
the way it encourages everyone to be able to work on a project at once, 
even if you aren't part of a core team. Sure, it's possible on 
launchpad/bitbucket, it doesn't seem to be as actively encouraged though.


 Anyway, I don't actually care about this issue anymore, and I'm not posting
 here looking for help on it. I dislike Git/TortoiseGit, but at least I can
 get by with them, whereas I've pretty much concluded at this point that
 hg-git just isn't worth bothering with.


You're probably better off for it - I used to be strongly in the 
mercurial camp, but having used git for a while I find I vastly prefer 
it, despite still not knowing how to do quite a bit with it.


 But the point is, I really appreciate how awesome the D community is
 compared to so many others.


/* I can't speak for everyone */
nick ~= (1/communities["D"].length) * thanks;

PS Sorry if this doesn't read well, I replied from bottom to top :S
-- 
Robert
http://octarineparrot.com/
Jun 10 2011
next sibling parent reply Trass3r <un known.com> writes:
Am 10.06.2011, 13:48 Uhr, schrieb Robert Clipsham  
<robert octarineparrot.com>:

 You're probably better off for it - I used to be strongly in the  
 mercurial camp, but having used git for a while I find I vastly prefer  
 it, despite still not knowing how to do quite a bit with it.


Yep, Mercurial's biggest drawback imo is that bookmarks (which let you do  
something analogous to git's branches) aren't standard and thus aren't  
pushed/pulled by default.
And of course github is way better than bitbucket, but that's not  
Mercurial's fault I admit.
Jun 10 2011
next sibling parent =?UTF-8?B?IkrDqXLDtG1lIE0uIEJlcmdlciI=?= <jeberger free.fr> writes:
Trass3r wrote:

 Am 10.06.2011, 13:48 Uhr, schrieb Robert Clipsham
 <robert octarineparrot.com>:

 You're probably better off for it - I used to be strongly in the
 mercurial camp, but having used git for a while I find I vastly prefer=





 it, despite still not knowing how to do quite a bit with it.


=20
 Yep, Mercurial's biggest drawback imo is that bookmarks (which let you
 do something analogous to git's branches) aren't standard and thus
 aren't pushed/pulled by default.


	Bookmarks are local by definition. If you want the same
functionality that can be pushed/pulled, you should use branches. Or
did I miss something?

		Jerome
--=20
mailto:jeberger free.fr
http://jeberger.free.fr
Jabber: jeberger jabber.fr
Jun 10 2011
prev sibling parent reply "Nick Sabalausky" <a a.a> writes:
"Trass3r" <un known.com> wrote in message news:op.vwu1q2lv3ncmek enigma...

 Am 10.06.2011, 13:48 Uhr, schrieb Robert Clipsham 
 <robert octarineparrot.com>:

 You're probably better off for it - I used to be strongly in the 
 mercurial camp, but having used git for a while I find I vastly prefer 
 it, despite still not knowing how to do quite a bit with it.


 Yep, Mercurial's biggest drawback imo is that bookmarks (which let you do 
 something analogous to git's branches) aren't standard and thus aren't 
 pushed/pulled by default.


Isn't cloning a sufficient equivalent to git's branches?


 And of course github is way better than bitbucket, but that's not 
 Mercurial's fault I admit.


Totally agree. Not that I'm big fan of GitHub, but yea, definitely better 
than BitBucket.
Jun 10 2011
parent reply Robert Clipsham <robert octarineparrot.com> writes:
On 10/06/2011 22:31, Nick Sabalausky wrote:

 "Trass3r"<un known.com>  wrote in message news:op.vwu1q2lv3ncmek enigma...

 Am 10.06.2011, 13:48 Uhr, schrieb Robert Clipsham
 <robert octarineparrot.com>:

 You're probably better off for it - I used to be strongly in the
 mercurial camp, but having used git for a while I find I vastly prefer
 it, despite still not knowing how to do quite a bit with it.


 Yep, Mercurial's biggest drawback imo is that bookmarks (which let you do
 something analogous to git's branches) aren't standard and thus aren't
 pushed/pulled by default.


 Isn't cloning a sufficient equivalent to git's branches?


Cloning is a lot slower and a lot less convenient. You end up with the 
SVN style of having multiple directories to keep track of everything in, 
a complete pain. Mercurial does have branches, but they are magnitudes 
slower than in git, and even the documentation for hg recommends cloning 
if you want to do anything serious.


 And of course github is way better than bitbucket, but that's not
 Mercurial's fault I admit.


 Totally agree. Not that I'm big fan of GitHub, but yea, definitely better
 than BitBucket.


I'm subscribed to both github and bitbucket blogs (or was anyway), the 
rate at which github adds cool stuff is far greater than that of 
bitbucket, I can't help but feel bitbucket is playing catch up.

-- 
Robert
http://octarineparrot.com/
Jun 11 2011
parent reply Andrej Mitrovic <andrej.mitrovich gmail.com> writes:
My only problem with github is its extremely slow code display.
Opening up a larger module such as std.algorithm freezes firefox for a
good couple of seconds (ok, maybe firefox is to blame for not running
tabs concurrently or something), and scrolling is terribly slow too. I
could make some coffee while std.datetime opens.. And I'm running a
quad-core with 3 Gigs of RAM <rolleyes>.

And then they say the desktop is dead. With this performance.. I don't think so.

Also +1 on the great community. Maybe it's because we're a small
community so we tend to help each other more often. It's kind of like
the difference between living in a large metropolis and a small
village. I used to live in the latter for about a year or so when I
was restoring my apartment, and nearly everyone that passes next to me
said hello, and asked me about my day. It was very cozy living there.
:)
Jun 11 2011
parent reply David Nadlinger <see klickverbot.at> writes:
On 6/11/11 8:18 PM, Andrej Mitrovic wrote:

 My only problem with github is its extremely slow code display.
 Opening up a larger module such as std.algorithm freezes firefox for a
 good couple of seconds (ok, maybe firefox is to blame for not running
 tabs concurrently or something), and scrolling is terribly slow too. I
 could make some coffee while std.datetime opens.. And I'm running a
 quad-core with 3 Gigs of RAM<rolleyes>.


This is strange, std.algorithm opens and scrolls super-smoothly here in 
both Firefox and Chrome (OS X) – without syntax highlighting though, 
presumably to avoid the precise problem you experience because the file 
is quite large.

And std.datetime doesn't even display in the GitHub UI due to its sheer 
size, but the »raw« view loads fast here as well (Firefox and Chrome 
again) – problems with that would rather be due to browser limitations 
or connection issues, I suppose, unless GitHub are screwing up serving a 
text file.

David
Jun 11 2011
next sibling parent reply Andrej Mitrovic <andrej.mitrovich gmail.com> writes:
On 6/11/11, David Nadlinger <see klickverbot.at> wrote:

 On 6/11/11 8:18 PM, Andrej Mitrovic wrote:

 My only problem with github is its extremely slow code display.
 Opening up a larger module such as std.algorithm freezes firefox for a
 good couple of seconds (ok, maybe firefox is to blame for not running
 tabs concurrently or something), and scrolling is terribly slow too. I
 could make some coffee while std.datetime opens.. And I'm running a
 quad-core with 3 Gigs of RAM<rolleyes>.


 This is strange, std.algorithm opens and scrolls super-smoothly here in
 both Firefox and Chrome (OS X) =96 without syntax highlighting though,
 presumably to avoid the precise problem you experience because the file
 is quite large.

 And std.datetime doesn't even display in the GitHub UI due to its sheer
 size, but the =BBraw=AB view loads fast here as well (Firefox and Chrome
 again) =96 problems with that would rather be due to browser limitations
 or connection issues, I suppose, unless GitHub are screwing up serving a
 text file.

 David


Yeah there's no syntax highlighting in std.algorithm but it still take
8 seconds to load the tab (firefox freezes during that time), and then
scrolling acts erratic. Using raw is ok, it's just a text file in a
browser so that doesn't cause any issues.

Hmm.. maybe one of my installed firefox plugin has gone rogue or
something. I'll see if I can recreate this issue in IE/Chrome.
Jun 11 2011
next sibling parent Andrej Mitrovic <andrej.mitrovich gmail.com> writes:
On 6/11/11, David Nadlinger <see klickverbot.at> wrote:

 On 6/11/11 9:27 PM, Andrej Mitrovic wrote:

 [=85]Using raw is ok, it's just a text file in a
 browser so that doesn't cause any issues.


 I thought you could =BBmake some coffee while std.datetime opens=AB? ;)

 David


For std.algorithm, I could. If the coffee was instant and I had a hot
cup of water. :P
Jun 11 2011
prev sibling parent reply Andrej Mitrovic <andrej.mitrovich gmail.com> writes:
Holy hell Chrome loads it in a blink of an eye, no lag whatsoever and
there's no laggy scrollbar either. Kudos to Google, I guess.
Jun 11 2011
parent Lutger Blijdestijn <lutger.blijdestijn gmail.com> writes:
Andrej Mitrovic wrote:


 Holy hell Chrome loads it in a blink of an eye, no lag whatsoever and
 there's no laggy scrollbar either. Kudos to Google, I guess.


Google did an awesome job with webkit and v8 (plus loads of caching). I'm 
running firefox 5 beta however and it's catching up with IE9 and chrome in 
performance. std.algorithm loads in 1-2 seconds and scrolling is fine.
Jun 12 2011
prev sibling next sibling parent Andrej Mitrovic <andrej.mitrovich gmail.com> writes:
* Btw. you're right about datetime, it doesn't even display in github
except the raw version, I had that wrong.

I just checked with IE, it works perfectly. Now I have to figure out
which FF plugin is causing this mess. Happy times..
Jun 11 2011
prev sibling parent Andrej Mitrovic <andrej.mitrovich gmail.com> writes:
Well this is nuts I've disabled all plugins and it still freezes..
I'll give FF4 a try, if that thing doesn't work I'll have to consider
doing yet another browser switch. I hate doing these things..
Jun 11 2011
prev sibling next sibling parent reply Graham Fawcett <fawcett uwindsor.ca> writes:
On Fri, 10 Jun 2011 12:48:30 +0100, Robert Clipsham wrote:

 
 /* I can't speak for everyone */
 nick ~= (1/communities["D"].length) * thanks;


I hope 'communities["D"].length' isn't an integer! :)

Graham
Jun 10 2011
parent Robert Clipsham <robert octarineparrot.com> writes:
On 10/06/2011 15:14, Graham Fawcett wrote:

 On Fri, 10 Jun 2011 12:48:30 +0100, Robert Clipsham wrote:

 /* I can't speak for everyone */
 nick ~= (1/communities["D"].length) * thanks;


 I hope 'communities["D"].length' isn't an integer! :)

 Graham


What, my code has to be valid as well now?! What sort of community is 
this? :D

-- 
Robert
http://octarineparrot.com/
Jun 10 2011
prev sibling parent "Nick Sabalausky" <a a.a> writes:
"Robert Clipsham" <robert octarineparrot.com> wrote in message 
news:ist0iv$s2p$1 digitalmars.com...

 PS Sorry if this doesn't read well, I replied from bottom to top :S


Ahh, you must be one of those Forth coders.
Jun 10 2011