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digitalmars.D - D on top of Hacker News!

reply Sameer Pradhan <pradhan cemantix.org> writes:
It was nice to read Walter's article from 2014...
Wonder who posted it, and how long it will stay in the visibility 
range, but it was a nice feeling to see it at the top.

--
Sameer
Jun 03 2018
next sibling parent reply I love Ice Cream <IloveIcecream. icecreamsandwhich.com> writes:
 Is D really a top 20 language? I don't remember seeing it 
 anywhere close to the top 20.



 https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/ has them in 31


Top comment is kind of depressing.
Jun 03 2018
next sibling parent reply bauss <jj_1337 live.dk> writes:
On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 17:40:46 UTC, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 Is D really a top 20 language? I don't remember seeing it 
 anywhere close to the top 20.



 https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/ has them in 31


 Top comment is kind of depressing.


Tiobe is based on Google searches, so it's not relevant anymore.
Jun 04 2018
parent reply I love Ice Cream <IloveIcecream. icecreamsandwhich.com> writes:
On Monday, 4 June 2018 at 11:14:42 UTC, bauss wrote:

 On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 17:40:46 UTC, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 Is D really a top 20 language? I don't remember seeing it 
 anywhere close to the top 20.



 https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/ has them in 31


 Top comment is kind of depressing.


 Tiobe is based on Google searches, so it's not relevant anymore.


Since when is Google not relevant?
Jun 04 2018
parent reply rikki cattermole <rikki cattermole.co.nz> writes:
On 05/06/2018 3:56 AM, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 On Monday, 4 June 2018 at 11:14:42 UTC, bauss wrote:

 On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 17:40:46 UTC, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 Is D really a top 20 language? I don't remember seeing it anywhere 
 close to the top 20.



 https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/ has them in 31


 Top comment is kind of depressing.


 Tiobe is based on Google searches, so it's not relevant anymore.


 
 Since when is Google not relevant?


Google modifies search results per person/client and can hide results 
out right if it chooses to (unconfirmed, but its a good guess).

When it comes to analysis it does not qualify as a research source 
anymore. It is merely a starting point for your research and does not 
play a major role.
Jun 04 2018
parent reply I love Ice Cream <IloveIcecream. icecreamsandwhich.com> writes:
On Monday, 4 June 2018 at 16:05:24 UTC, rikki cattermole wrote:

 On 05/06/2018 3:56 AM, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 On Monday, 4 June 2018 at 11:14:42 UTC, bauss wrote:

 On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 17:40:46 UTC, I love Ice Cream 
 wrote:

 Is D really a top 20 language? I don't remember seeing it 
 anywhere close to the top 20.



 https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/ has them in 31


 Top comment is kind of depressing.


 Tiobe is based on Google searches, so it's not relevant 
 anymore.


 
 Since when is Google not relevant?


 Google modifies search results per person/client and can hide 
 results out right if it chooses to (unconfirmed, but its a good 
 guess).

 When it comes to analysis it does not qualify as a research 
 source anymore. It is merely a starting point for your research 
 and does not play a major role.


It seems you guys are undercutting the results because you don't 
like them:


 The index covers searches in Google, Google Blogs, MSN, Yahoo!, 
 Baidu, Wikipedia and YouTube.
Jun 04 2018
next sibling parent reply Ethan <gooberman gmail.com> writes:
On Monday, 4 June 2018 at 19:17:47 UTC, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 It seems you guys are undercutting the results because you 
 don't like them:


Never mind that it is a commonly accepted criticism of the Tiobe 
index. Someone on the internet wants to strawman, so it must be 
valid!

(The only source you listed there that would give unbiased search 
results is Wikipedia. Every other aggregate engine weighs results 
per user.
Jun 04 2018
parent I love Ice Cream <IloveIcecream. icecreamsandwhich.com> writes:
On Monday, 4 June 2018 at 19:21:22 UTC, Ethan wrote:

 On Monday, 4 June 2018 at 19:17:47 UTC, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 It seems you guys are undercutting the results because you 
 don't like them:


 Never mind that it is a commonly accepted criticism of the 
 Tiobe index. Someone on the internet wants to strawman, so it 
 must be valid!

 (The only source you listed there that would give unbiased 
 search results is Wikipedia. Every other aggregate engine 
 weighs results per user.


Can you name something without valid criticisms? Things could 
always be done better. But that doesn't mean they aren't useful. 
In this case it isn't meant to be an all encompassing answer, 
just a viewpoint that suggests a particular answer.
Jun 04 2018
prev sibling parent I love Ice Cream <IloveIcecream. icecreamsandwhich.com> writes:
On Monday, 4 June 2018 at 19:17:47 UTC, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 On Monday, 4 June 2018 at 16:05:24 UTC, rikki cattermole wrote:

 On 05/06/2018 3:56 AM, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 On Monday, 4 June 2018 at 11:14:42 UTC, bauss wrote:

 On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 17:40:46 UTC, I love Ice Cream 
 wrote:

 Is D really a top 20 language? I don't remember seeing it 
 anywhere close to the top 20.



 https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/ has them in 31


 Top comment is kind of depressing.


 Tiobe is based on Google searches, so it's not relevant 
 anymore.


 
 Since when is Google not relevant?


 Google modifies search results per person/client and can hide 
 results out right if it chooses to (unconfirmed, but its a 
 good guess).

 When it comes to analysis it does not qualify as a research 
 source anymore. It is merely a starting point for your 
 research and does not play a major role.


 It seems you guys are undercutting the results because you 
 don't like them:


 The index covers searches in Google, Google Blogs, MSN, 
 Yahoo!, Baidu, Wikipedia and YouTube.




http://githut.info/

http://pypl.github.io/PYPL.html

http://sogrady-media.redmonk.com/sogrady/files/2018/03/lang.rank_.118.png

https://spectrum.ieee.org/computing/software/the-2017-top-programming-languages

https://insights.stackoverflow.com/survey/2016

Looks consistent with other results.
Jun 04 2018
prev sibling parent reply Dejan Lekic <dejan.lekic gmail.com> writes:
On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 17:40:46 UTC, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 Is D really a top 20 language? I don't remember seeing it 
 anywhere close to the top 20.



 https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/ has them in 31


 Top comment is kind of depressing.


The right place to look is https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/d/

I agree with other comments regarding TIOBE - they are constantly 
changing how they do statistics so they are not relevant source 
at all. Just look where Kotlin is there and that should pretty 
much tell you everything. I know at least 10 large companies that 
are moving from Java/Scala to Kotlin, yet Kotlin is at the bottom 
50 table... Ridiculous...
Jun 05 2018
parent reply Jonathan M Davis <newsgroup.d jmdavisprog.com> writes:
On Tuesday, June 05, 2018 15:09:56 Dejan Lekic via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 17:40:46 UTC, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 Is D really a top 20 language? I don't remember seeing it
 anywhere close to the top 20.

 https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/ has them in 31


 Top comment is kind of depressing.


 The right place to look is https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/d/

 I agree with other comments regarding TIOBE - they are constantly
 changing how they do statistics so they are not relevant source
 at all. Just look where Kotlin is there and that should pretty
 much tell you everything. I know at least 10 large companies that
 are moving from Java/Scala to Kotlin, yet Kotlin is at the bottom
 50 table... Ridiculous...


The TIOBE has never been a measurement of how much any given language is
used. At best, it's been a measurement of which languages folks have been
searching for. That can tell you something, but you have to understand what
it's measuring to have any clue what it does tell you. And of course,
because of how difficult it is to measure search results for a particular
language, they keep changing their criteria. The result is that while the
tiobe index may be interesting, it must be taken with a very large grain of
salt - and that's without getting into any discussions of how valid it is or
isn't to use search results from google to do the measuring.

- Jonathan M Davis
Jun 05 2018
parent reply I love Ice Cream <IloveIcecream. icecreamsandwhich.com> writes:
On Tuesday, 5 June 2018 at 20:15:07 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote:

 On Tuesday, June 05, 2018 15:09:56 Dejan Lekic via 
 Digitalmars-d wrote:

 On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 17:40:46 UTC, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 Is D really a top 20 language? I don't remember seeing it 
 anywhere close to the top 20.

 https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/ has them in 31


 Top comment is kind of depressing.


 The right place to look is https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/d/

 I agree with other comments regarding TIOBE - they are 
 constantly changing how they do statistics so they are not 
 relevant source at all. Just look where Kotlin is there and 
 that should pretty much tell you everything. I know at least 
 10 large companies that are moving from Java/Scala to Kotlin, 
 yet Kotlin is at the bottom 50 table... Ridiculous...


 The TIOBE has never been a measurement of how much any given 
 language is used. At best, it's been a measurement of which 
 languages folks have been searching for. That can tell you 
 something, but you have to understand what it's measuring to 
 have any clue what it does tell you. And of course, because of 
 how difficult it is to measure search results for a particular 
 language, they keep changing their criteria. The result is that 
 while the tiobe index may be interesting, it must be taken with 
 a very large grain of salt - and that's without getting into 
 any discussions of how valid it is or isn't to use search 
 results from google to do the measuring.

 - Jonathan M Davis


And all of the other metrics done by other groups that was 
provided that paints a similar picture?

http://githut.info/

http://pypl.github.io/PYPL.html

http://sogrady-media.redmonk.com/sogrady/files/2018/03/lang.rank_.118.png

https://spectrum.ieee.org/computing/software/the-2017-top-programming-languages

https://insights.stackoverflow.com/survey/2016

I'm not really intending to crap on anyone here. It's just the 
dismissal of a collection of data all pointing towards one 
particular conclusion is a bit strange. It seems like the 
interest in D is going down not up. I mean it could have a 
renaissance, but I'd imagine some work would have to be put into 
that to make it happen.
Jun 05 2018
parent bachmeier <no spam.net> writes:
On Tuesday, 5 June 2018 at 21:53:51 UTC, I love Ice Cream wrote:

 On Tuesday, 5 June 2018 at 20:15:07 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote:

 On Tuesday, June 05, 2018 15:09:56 Dejan Lekic via 
 Digitalmars-d wrote:

 On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 17:40:46 UTC, I love Ice Cream 
 wrote:

 Is D really a top 20 language? I don't remember seeing it 
 anywhere close to the top 20.

 https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/ has them in 31


 Top comment is kind of depressing.


 The right place to look is 
 https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/d/

 I agree with other comments regarding TIOBE - they are 
 constantly changing how they do statistics so they are not 
 relevant source at all. Just look where Kotlin is there and 
 that should pretty much tell you everything. I know at least 
 10 large companies that are moving from Java/Scala to Kotlin, 
 yet Kotlin is at the bottom 50 table... Ridiculous...


 The TIOBE has never been a measurement of how much any given 
 language is used. At best, it's been a measurement of which 
 languages folks have been searching for. That can tell you 
 something, but you have to understand what it's measuring to 
 have any clue what it does tell you. And of course, because of 
 how difficult it is to measure search results for a particular 
 language, they keep changing their criteria. The result is 
 that while the tiobe index may be interesting, it must be 
 taken with a very large grain of salt - and that's without 
 getting into any discussions of how valid it is or isn't to 
 use search results from google to do the measuring.

 - Jonathan M Davis


 And all of the other metrics done by other groups that was 
 provided that paints a similar picture?

 http://githut.info/

 http://pypl.github.io/PYPL.html

 http://sogrady-media.redmonk.com/sogrady/files/2018/03/lang.rank_.118.png

 https://spectrum.ieee.org/computing/software/the-2017-top-programming-languages

 https://insights.stackoverflow.com/survey/2016

 I'm not really intending to crap on anyone here. It's just the 
 dismissal of a collection of data all pointing towards one 
 particular conclusion is a bit strange. It seems like the 
 interest in D is going down not up. I mean it could have a 
 renaissance, but I'd imagine some work would have to be put 
 into that to make it happen.


The first link shows D having more repos. The third doesn't show 
changes in language popularity over time. I can't find any info 
about D usage over time in the other three links. The Stack 
Overflow survey isn't going to be informative anyway because most 
activity for D occurs here, not on SO, so it wouldn't be 
representative.
Jun 05 2018
prev sibling parent reply JakubJ <jjanarek gmail.com> writes:
On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 16:58:23 UTC, Sameer Pradhan wrote:

 It was nice to read Walter's article from 2014...
 Wonder who posted it, and how long it will stay in the 
 visibility range, but it was a nice feeling to see it at the 
 top.

 --
 Sameer


Hi Sameer, I just discovered it today and posted it afterwards. 
Then, looked into this forum and surprise ;) .

However, I don't plan on jumping into D right now because I'm 
starting to use Elixir/OTP seriously at GSoC and between that and 
the finals at uni there's little time left.

Jakub
Jun 03 2018
parent Sameer Pradhan <pradhan cemantix.org> writes:
On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 20:12:03 UTC, JakubJ wrote:

 On Sunday, 3 June 2018 at 16:58:23 UTC, Sameer Pradhan wrote:

 It was nice to read Walter's article from 2014...
 Wonder who posted it, and how long it will stay in the 
 visibility range, but it was a nice feeling to see it at the 
 top.

 --
 Sameer


 Hi Sameer, I just discovered it today and posted it afterwards. 
 Then, looked into this forum and surprise ;) .


:-)


 However, I don't plan on jumping into D right now because I'm 
 starting to use Elixir/OTP seriously at GSoC and between that 
 and the finals at uni there's little time left.


In case you missed it, Walter did an AMA and answered some of the 
issues raised in the HN comments.
Jun 04 2018