• Jean-Louis Leroy (3/3) Mar 26 2018 ...as a "programming languages you should learn now" - albeit
• Joakim (3/6) Mar 26 2018 Eh, never bad to be mentioned in articles like that, could
• Jean-Louis Leroy (2/10) Mar 26 2018 Indeed!
• bauss (3/11) Mar 26 2018 D should have been under the "if you know Java" and "if you know
• bauss (12/24) Mar 26 2018 Also it's not exactly a "good" mention. It kinda gives D a bad
• rjframe (3/5) Mar 26 2018 It looks like the article was written by someone that doesn't know much
• Bienlein (20/32) Mar 29 2018 I agree that this should be the case. But I can see the point of
• Johannes Loher (13/17) Mar 29 2018 I have to say, my experience was totally different. I recently had quite
• rumbu (3/7) Mar 29 2018 Sure, let's prepare two separate DIPs: -betterjava and
• bauss (4/25) Mar 29 2018 I landed a previous job using .NET about two years ago, because
• Bienlein (9/23) Mar 31 2018 Yes, I beliebe that enthusiasm and passion is something people
• bauss (4/8) Mar 31 2018 Yep, that's pretty much what I did. I had some projects on Github
• crimaniak (2/3) Mar 26 2018 Looks like R advertising.
• bauss (2/6) Mar 26 2018 Funny, I was thinking the same.
• bachmeier (4/8) Mar 27 2018 I don't see how. Yes, R was mentioned many times, but as a way to
• Anton Fediushin (9/20) Mar 26 2018 I'm not sure if this kind of mention is any good for D. It's more
• Chris (13/13) Mar 27 2018 On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 06:42:29 UTC, Anton Fediushin wrote:
• bauss (5/19) Mar 27 2018 Yes that is true, BUT it also gives the wrong portray of D, when
• Chris (13/39) Mar 27 2018 I agree. However, these are misconceptions that D has had to live
• bauss (7/49) Mar 27 2018 Yes I agree it's great that D is talked about.
• Chris (9/15) Mar 27 2018 I know. But this will take time, and it will happen in the end,
• bauss (2/20) Mar 27 2018 Yes indeed!
• Steven Schveighoffer (5/10) Mar 29 2018 "If you’re programming in C or C++, you’re doing embedded stuff,
• ElectronCharge (20/29) Mar 31 2018 Yes, this was an inane article... It also included the horrible

Jean-Louis Leroy <jl leroy.nyc> writes:

...as a "programming languages you should learn now" - albeit 
somewhat dismissively ;-)

https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-should-learn-now.html

Joakim <dlang joakim.fea.st> writes:

On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 15:52:11 UTC, Jean-Louis Leroy wrote:
 ...as a "programming languages you should learn now" - albeit 
 somewhat dismissively ;-)

 https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-should-learn-now.html

Eh, never bad to be mentioned in articles like that, could 
encourage some to try D.

Jean-Louis Leroy <jl leroy.nyc> writes:

On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 16:13:17 UTC, Joakim wrote:
 On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 15:52:11 UTC, Jean-Louis Leroy 
 wrote:
 ...as a "programming languages you should learn now" - albeit 
 somewhat dismissively ;-)

 https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-should-learn-now.html

 Eh, never bad to be mentioned in articles like that, could 
 encourage some to try D.

Indeed!

bauss <jj_1337 live.dk> writes:

On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 16:13:17 UTC, Joakim wrote:
 On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 15:52:11 UTC, Jean-Louis Leroy 
 wrote:
 ...as a "programming languages you should learn now" - albeit 
 somewhat dismissively ;-)

 https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-should-learn-now.html

 Eh, never bad to be mentioned in articles like that, could 
 encourage some to try D.

D should have been under the "if you know Java" and "if you know 

bauss <jj_1337 live.dk> writes:

On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 17:49:18 UTC, bauss wrote:
 On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 16:13:17 UTC, Joakim wrote:
 On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 15:52:11 UTC, Jean-Louis Leroy 
 wrote:
 ...as a "programming languages you should learn now" - albeit 
 somewhat dismissively ;-)

 https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-should-learn-now.html

 Eh, never bad to be mentioned in articles like that, could 
 encourage some to try D.

 D should have been under the "if you know Java" and "if you 


Also it's not exactly a "good" mention. It kinda gives D a bad 
portrait.

"Learning D will not help you get a job anywhere, and it may be 
of little practical use."

Sure there isn't a lot of jobs strictly using D, but it's a great 
tool to use along side other languages.

I totally disaree with the "and it may be of little practical 
use"... 99% of things in D are practical, compared to any other 
languages.

Clearly it's written by someone who has never used D and just 
googled D real quick.

rjframe <dlang ryanjframe.com> writes:

On Mon, 26 Mar 2018 17:51:49 +0000, bauss wrote:

 Clearly it's written by someone who has never used D and just googled D
 real quick.

It looks like the article was written by someone that doesn't know much 
about most of those languages.

Bienlein <jeti789 web.de> writes:

On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 17:49:18 UTC, bauss wrote:
 On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 16:13:17 UTC, Joakim wrote:
 On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 15:52:11 UTC, Jean-Louis Leroy 
 wrote:
 ...as a "programming languages you should learn now" - albeit 
 somewhat dismissively ;-)

 https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-should-learn-now.html

 Eh, never bad to be mentioned in articles like that, could 
 encourage some to try D.

 D should have been under the "if you know Java" and "if you 


I agree that this should be the case. But I can see the point of 
the author saying D is something for C++ people to look into.

For C++ developers having some exposure to D might be a plus in 

Almost certainly in any job interview the people have never heard 
of a language named D. Being a Java developer some knowledge of 
Scala or Kotlin are a plus. Eventually they will listen to you 
for about half a minute why you like D. But in the end they will 
prefer someone with some working experience with Kotlin or Scala.

IMHO, the core D people are into system programming and from 
their background come from a C or C++ world. Also, it is hard to 

dll or so file. In Java this will also be the case in some 
upcoming JDK. Whatever, to call functions from dll or so file can 
also be done using Rust or plain C or C++. In my geographical 
surroundings here people will just stick to C or C++. Neither 
Rust nor D would be considered.

So I don't want to spread negative attitude. But how to make D 

Johannes Loher <johannes.loher fg4f.de> writes:

Am 29.03.2018 um 14:54 schrieb Bienlein:
 On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 17:49:18 UTC, bauss wrote:

 Eventually they will listen to you for about half a minute why you like
 D. But in the end they will prefer someone with some working experience
 with Kotlin or Scala.

I have to say, my experience was totally different. I recently had quite

Because I like D very much, obviously the topic came up in every single
interview. Most of the time, I was encouraged to solve the simple
programming tasks they gave me in D. I think they were actually quite
impressed, both by D itself and the fact that I am interested in such a
"niche" language. I believe showing that you are enthusiatic about such
things can help you with getting jobs much more than some experience in
a language which is "closer" to the language they mainly use.


in particular when you do OOP with D. I think you could make a case for
the statement, that D is closer to Java than it is to C.

rumbu <rumbu rumbu.ro> writes:

On Thursday, 29 March 2018 at 16:10:55 UTC, Johannes Loher wrote:

 Also I believe that D shares a lot of characteristics with Java 

 make a case for the statement, that D is closer to Java than it 
 is to C.

Sure, let's prepare two separate DIPs: -betterjava and 
-bettersharp :)

bauss <jj_1337 live.dk> writes:

On Thursday, 29 March 2018 at 16:10:55 UTC, Johannes Loher wrote:
 Am 29.03.2018 um 14:54 schrieb Bienlein:
 On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 17:49:18 UTC, bauss wrote:

 Eventually they will listen to you for about half a minute why 
 you like D. But in the end they will prefer someone with some 
 working experience with Kotlin or Scala.

 I have to say, my experience was totally different. I recently 
 had quite many job interviews for jobs in which I would mainly 

 topic came up in every single interview. Most of the time, I 
 was encouraged to solve the simple programming tasks they gave 
 me in D. I think they were actually quite impressed, both by D 
 itself and the fact that I am interested in such a "niche" 
 language. I believe showing that you are enthusiatic about such 
 things can help you with getting jobs much more than some 
 experience in a language which is "closer" to the language they 
 mainly use.

 Also I believe that D shares a lot of characteristics with Java 

 make a case for the statement, that D is closer to Java than it 
 is to C.

I landed a previous job using .NET about two years ago, because 
of some D code I had written, so for me the experience is 
different too.

Bienlein <jeti789 web.de> writes:

On Thursday, 29 March 2018 at 16:10:55 UTC, Johannes Loher wrote:

 I have to say, my experience was totally different. I recently 
 had quite many job interviews for jobs in which I would mainly 

 topic came up in every single interview. Most of the time, I 
 was encouraged to solve the simple programming tasks they gave 
 me in D. I think they were actually quite impressed, both by D 
 itself and the fact that I am interested in such a "niche" 
 language. I believe showing that you are enthusiatic about such 
 things can help you with getting jobs much more than some 
 experience in a language which is "closer" to the language they 
 mainly use.

Yes, I beliebe that enthusiasm and passion is something people 
are sometimes looking for at job interviews. In my last job 
interview I showed some passion about concurrent programming and 
I think they like that, that is the passion. Whether it is about 
concurrent programming or D might not be that important.

I landed a previous job using .NET about two years ago, because 
of some D code I >had written, so for me the experience is 
different too.

This is interesting. Maybe I write a little framwork or something 
in Kotlin and file it on github. Then I have something to show in 
any case. And from then on I can just play with D ;-)

bauss <jj_1337 live.dk> writes:

On Saturday, 31 March 2018 at 13:53:30 UTC, Bienlein wrote:
 This is interesting. Maybe I write a little framwork or 
 something in Kotlin and file it on github. Then I have 
 something to show in any case. And from then on I can just play 
 with D ;-)

Yep, that's pretty much what I did. I had some projects on Github 
along with some .NET code and they were more interested in my D 
code than my .NET code.

crimaniak <crimaniak gmail.com> writes:

On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 15:52:11 UTC, Jean-Louis Leroy wrote:

 https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-should-learn-now.html

Looks like R advertising.

bauss <jj_1337 live.dk> writes:

On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 01:50:17 UTC, crimaniak wrote:
 On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 15:52:11 UTC, Jean-Louis Leroy 
 wrote:

 https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-should-learn-now.html

 Looks like R advertising.

Funny, I was thinking the same.

bachmeier <no spam.net> writes:

On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 01:50:17 UTC, crimaniak wrote:
 On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 15:52:11 UTC, Jean-Louis Leroy 
 wrote:

 https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-should-learn-now.html

 Looks like R advertising.

I don't see how. Yes, R was mentioned many times, but as a way to 
generate graphs. That's a one hour exercise using 0.001% of R's 
functionality.

Anton Fediushin <fediushin.anton yandex.ru> writes:

On Monday, 26 March 2018 at 15:52:11 UTC, Jean-Louis Leroy wrote:
 ...as a "programming languages you should learn now" - albeit 
 somewhat dismissively ;-)

 https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-should-learn-now.html

 Learning D will not help you get a job anywhere, and it may be 
 of little practical use. But it is a convenient way to taste 
 managed memory and all of the “new” concepts without leaving 
 familiar tool chains and losing the C library.

I'm not sure if this kind of mention is any good for D. It's more 
like "look at C++'s stupid little brother. It's silly and 
useless".


 If you know C or C++, choose from these languages
 JavaScript

If I was an experienced C programmer I'd be insulted.

 Languages newbies should start with:
 HTML, CSS, and JavaScript

This would kill any motivation to learn programming. Also, HTML 
and CSS aren't programming languages.



Indeed, this article looks like, smells like and tastes like R 
advertisement. Maybe because it is?

Chris <wendlec tcd.ie> writes:

On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 06:42:29 UTC, Anton Fediushin wrote:

[snip]

"The only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked 
about." Oscar Wilde

"There's no such thing as bad publicity except your own 
obituary." Brendan Behan

Well, maybe the odd person will keep D in the back of his/her 
mind, also it says:

"But it is a convenient way to taste managed memory and all of 
the “new” concepts without leaving familiar tool chains and 
losing the C library."

So someone who's interested in that (plus C-interoperability!) 
might give D a shot. I was one of them a long long time ago.

bauss <jj_1337 live.dk> writes:

On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 10:31:34 UTC, Chris wrote:
 On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 06:42:29 UTC, Anton Fediushin 
 wrote:

 [snip]

 "The only thing worse than being talked about is not being 
 talked about." Oscar Wilde

 "There's no such thing as bad publicity except your own 
 obituary." Brendan Behan

 Well, maybe the odd person will keep D in the back of his/her 
 mind, also it says:

 "But it is a convenient way to taste managed memory and all of 
 the “new” concepts without leaving familiar tool chains and 
 losing the C library."

 So someone who's interested in that (plus C-interoperability!) 
 might give D a shot. I was one of them a long long time ago.

Yes that is true, BUT it also gives the wrong portray of D, when 
in fact D could fit into most, if not all the categories listed, 
but it's portrayed as if it only fits for C/C++ programmers and 
again not as something serious, but as a semi-useless toy.

Chris <wendlec tcd.ie> writes:

On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 10:46:03 UTC, bauss wrote:
 On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 10:31:34 UTC, Chris wrote:
 On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 06:42:29 UTC, Anton Fediushin 
 wrote:

 [snip]

 "The only thing worse than being talked about is not being 
 talked about." Oscar Wilde

 "There's no such thing as bad publicity except your own 
 obituary." Brendan Behan

 Well, maybe the odd person will keep D in the back of his/her 
 mind, also it says:

 "But it is a convenient way to taste managed memory and all of 
 the “new” concepts without leaving familiar tool chains and 
 losing the C library."

 So someone who's interested in that (plus C-interoperability!) 
 might give D a shot. I was one of them a long long time ago.

 Yes that is true, BUT it also gives the wrong portray of D, 
 when in fact D could fit into most, if not all the categories 
 listed, but it's portrayed as if it only fits for C/C++ 
 programmers and again not as something serious, but as a 
 semi-useless toy.

I agree. However, these are misconceptions that D has had to live 
with for years. It's hard to get rid of them. On the bright side, 
D gets a mention while years ago it wouldn't even have made it 
onto the list, which is a good sign, because it shows that D is 
on the tech-radar. Apparently it is being talked about and 
mentioned elsewhere in the tech-world and the author felt he 
couldn't just leave it out.

Also, as this thread shows, people take the language descriptions 
in the article with a grain of salt anyway (and rightly so!). So 
I think, all things considered, it's a good sign that D got 
mentioned. I remember, in the old days people would wonder why D 
wasn't on lists like that at all. So there's some progress there.

bauss <jj_1337 live.dk> writes:

On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 11:28:18 UTC, Chris wrote:
 On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 10:46:03 UTC, bauss wrote:
 On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 10:31:34 UTC, Chris wrote:
 On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 06:42:29 UTC, Anton Fediushin 
 wrote:

 [snip]

 "The only thing worse than being talked about is not being 
 talked about." Oscar Wilde

 "There's no such thing as bad publicity except your own 
 obituary." Brendan Behan

 Well, maybe the odd person will keep D in the back of his/her 
 mind, also it says:

 "But it is a convenient way to taste managed memory and all 
 of the “new” concepts without leaving familiar tool chains 
 and losing the C library."

 So someone who's interested in that (plus 
 C-interoperability!) might give D a shot. I was one of them a 
 long long time ago.

 Yes that is true, BUT it also gives the wrong portray of D, 
 when in fact D could fit into most, if not all the categories 
 listed, but it's portrayed as if it only fits for C/C++ 
 programmers and again not as something serious, but as a 
 semi-useless toy.

 I agree. However, these are misconceptions that D has had to 
 live with for years. It's hard to get rid of them. On the 
 bright side, D gets a mention while years ago it wouldn't even 
 have made it onto the list, which is a good sign, because it 
 shows that D is on the tech-radar. Apparently it is being 
 talked about and mentioned elsewhere in the tech-world and the 
 author felt he couldn't just leave it out.

 Also, as this thread shows, people take the language 
 descriptions in the article with a grain of salt anyway (and 
 rightly so!). So I think, all things considered, it's a good 
 sign that D got mentioned. I remember, in the old days people 
 would wonder why D wasn't on lists like that at all. So there's 
 some progress there.

Yes I agree it's great that D is talked about.

I just feel like someone is dropping salt into my coffee when 
it's misinterpreted.

I hope one day all the legacy, non-relevant issues D had will 
cease to exist and that it will be looked upon what it is 
__today__ instead of what it was in the __past__

Chris <wendlec tcd.ie> writes:

On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 12:17:44 UTC, bauss wrote:

 Yes I agree it's great that D is talked about.

 I just feel like someone is dropping salt into my coffee when 
 it's misinterpreted.

 I hope one day all the legacy, non-relevant issues D had will 
 cease to exist and that it will be looked upon what it is 
 __today__ instead of what it was in the __past__

I know. But this will take time, and it will happen in the end, 
if the D community keeps up the good work. Nothing beats 
tenacicty. And if you look at the companies using D, these are 
facts that cannot be ignored forever (e.g. Funkwerk 
http://www.funkwerk.com/en/). If articles like that annoy you, 
I'd say you either write to them or if there's a section for 
comments, set the record straight right below the article to the 
readers' benefit.

bauss <jj_1337 live.dk> writes:

On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 12:47:57 UTC, Chris wrote:
 On Tuesday, 27 March 2018 at 12:17:44 UTC, bauss wrote:

 Yes I agree it's great that D is talked about.

 I just feel like someone is dropping salt into my coffee when 
 it's misinterpreted.

 I hope one day all the legacy, non-relevant issues D had will 
 cease to exist and that it will be looked upon what it is 
 __today__ instead of what it was in the __past__

 I know. But this will take time, and it will happen in the end, 
 if the D community keeps up the good work. Nothing beats 
 tenacicty. And if you look at the companies using D, these are 
 facts that cannot be ignored forever (e.g. Funkwerk 
 http://www.funkwerk.com/en/). If articles like that annoy you, 
 I'd say you either write to them or if there's a section for 
 comments, set the record straight right below the article to 
 the readers' benefit.

Yes indeed!

Steven Schveighoffer <schveiguy yahoo.com> writes:

On 3/26/18 11:52 AM, Jean-Louis Leroy wrote:
 ....as a "programming languages you should learn now" - albeit somewhat 
 dismissively ;-)
 
 https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-s
ould-learn-now.html 
 

"If you’re programming in C or C++, you’re doing embedded stuff, 
drivers, or low-level stuff—or you’re just old"

Ouch! Also, destroys any credibility of the author. Moving on...

-Steve

ElectronCharge <dylan.fun gmail.com> writes:

On Thursday, 29 March 2018 at 13:39:25 UTC, Steven Schveighoffer 
wrote:
 On 3/26/18 11:52 AM, Jean-Louis Leroy wrote:
 ....as a "programming languages you should learn now" - albeit 
 somewhat dismissively ;-)
 
 https://www.infoworld.com/article/3263395/application-development/the-programming-languages-you-should-learn-now.html
 

 "If you’re programming in C or C++, you’re doing embedded 
 stuff, drivers, or low-level stuff—or you’re just old"

 Ouch! Also, destroys any credibility of the author. Moving on...

Yes, this was an inane article... It also included the horrible 
advice:

"Languages you should not learn today
[...]

Java
If you’re not a seasoned Java developer or planning to work for a 
body shop like Wipro or Infosys, by the time you don’t suck in 
Java your friends will have run rings around you careerwise in 
JavaScript as “full-stack developers.”"

Er, a whole lot of backend code is not written in Javascript, and 
for good reason. Java is near the top of of the heap as far as 
hiring goes, and Java developers generally command a better 
salary than front-end developers. Java is also pretty good to 
work with today, Java 8 added a lot of nice functional features.

It's insane that Swift wasn't mentioned anywhere in the article. 
It also left out some interesting, influential languages like 
Haskell, Julia, Nim, Dart, Typescript and Clojure. I hope not too 
many folks are basing decisions on that tripe.