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digitalmars.D - D Management Site

reply "Jonathan Marler" <johnnymarler gmail.com> writes:
Would people want and use a website that tracks who's working on 
what in the D Programming Language?  People would go to the site 
and be able to find out what's being worked on, what's not being 
worked on, who's working on what, what bugs are being worked on.  
People will have to use the site and submit what they are working 
on though.  I'd be willing to write such a site if people think 
it would be useful.
Jan 27 2015
next sibling parent reply Andrei Alexandrescu <SeeWebsiteForEmail erdani.org> writes:
On 1/27/15 10:10 AM, Jonathan Marler wrote:

 Would people want and use a website that tracks who's working on what in
 the D Programming Language?  People would go to the site and be able to
 find out what's being worked on, what's not being worked on, who's
 working on what, what bugs are being worked on. People will have to use
 the site and submit what they are working on though.  I'd be willing to
 write such a site if people think it would be useful.


We used http://trello.com for a while, it didn't catch up.

Stuff we're working on, help welcome: http://goo.gl/N28FaC

Stuff we're currently not working on, help welcome: http://goo.gl/lqKrsT


Thanks!

Andrei
Jan 27 2015
parent reply "Jonathan Marler" <johnnymarler gmail.com> writes:
On Tuesday, 27 January 2015 at 18:25:21 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu 
wrote:

 On 1/27/15 10:10 AM, Jonathan Marler wrote:

 Would people want and use a website that tracks who's working 
 on what in
 the D Programming Language?  People would go to the site and 
 be able to
 find out what's being worked on, what's not being worked on, 
 who's
 working on what, what bugs are being worked on. People will 
 have to use
 the site and submit what they are working on though.  I'd be 
 willing to
 write such a site if people think it would be useful.


 We used http://trello.com for a while, it didn't catch up.

 Stuff we're working on, help welcome: http://goo.gl/N28FaC

 Stuff we're currently not working on, help welcome: 
 http://goo.gl/lqKrsT


 Thanks!

 Andrei


Yes looking at PRs and Issues on github does solve the problems I 
posted.  There are other issues I could list but I didn't know 
that the community has already tired this before (trello).  Maybe 
not the best use of my time then.

I will say I agreed with your post about us needing to focus on 
the important features.  Since you have a much bigger picture of 
what's important to get done, could you list a few features you 
think are the highest priority to get done that aren't being 
worked on? I could take a gander and try to tackle one.  Thanks.
Jan 27 2015
parent Andrei Alexandrescu <SeeWebsiteForEmail erdan.org> writes:
"Jonathan Marler" <johnnymarler gmail.com> wrote:

 On Tuesday, 27 January 2015 at 18:25:21 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:

 On 1/27/15 10:10 AM, Jonathan Marler wrote:

 Would people want and use a website that tracks who's working >> on what in
 the D Programming Language?  People would go to the site and >> be able to
 find out what's being worked on, what's not being worked on, >> who's
 working on what, what bugs are being worked on. People will >> have to use
 the site and submit what they are working on though.  I'd be >> willing to
 write such a site if people think it would be useful.


 
 We used http://trello.com for a while, it didn't catch up.
 
 Stuff we're working on, help welcome: http://goo.gl/N28FaC
 
 Stuff we're currently not working on, help welcome: > http://goo.gl/lqKrsT
 
 
 Thanks!
 
 Andrei


 
 Yes looking at PRs and Issues on github does solve the problems I posted.
  There are other issues I could list but I didn't know that the community
 has already tired this before (trello).  Maybe not the best use of my time
then.
 
 I will say I agreed with your post about us needing to focus on the
 important features.  Since you have a much bigger picture of what's
 important to get done, could you list a few features you think are the
 highest priority to get done that aren't being worked on? I could take a
 gander and try to tackle one.  Thanks.


I will, and soon. I've been planning to do so since Jan 1st.
Jan 27 2015
prev sibling next sibling parent reply Jacob Carlborg <doob me.com> writes:
On 2015-01-27 19:10, Jonathan Marler wrote:

 Would people want and use a website that tracks who's working on what in
 the D Programming Language?  People would go to the site and be able to
 find out what's being worked on, what's not being worked on, who's
 working on what, what bugs are being worked on. People will have to use
 the site and submit what they are working on though.  I'd be willing to
 write such a site if people think it would be useful.


I would assume you mean something not just for the D core project but 
for the whole D community. Like, is someone working on a GUI library, 
who is working on database adapters, and so on.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg
Jan 27 2015
parent "Jonathan Marler" <johnnymarler gmail.com> writes:
On Tuesday, 27 January 2015 at 20:59:10 UTC, Jacob Carlborg wrote:

 On 2015-01-27 19:10, Jonathan Marler wrote:

 Would people want and use a website that tracks who's working 
 on what in
 the D Programming Language?  People would go to the site and 
 be able to
 find out what's being worked on, what's not being worked on, 
 who's
 working on what, what bugs are being worked on. People will 
 have to use
 the site and submit what they are working on though.  I'd be 
 willing to
 write such a site if people think it would be useful.


 I would assume you mean something not just for the D core 
 project but for the whole D community. Like, is someone working 
 on a GUI library, who is working on database adapters, and so 
 on.


I wasn't going to explore this anymore but since you asked :) Yes 
it would apply to the whole D community.  I jotted down some 
notes to summarize some of my initial thoughts on the features it 
could provide...here they are:


Problems mapped to Features
-------------------------------------
Problem: Knowing what people want.
Features: "Priority Points"

Problem: Knowing what the leadership wants.
Features: "Priority Points" and "Follow Developers"

Problem: Knowing what isn't being worked on.
Features: "Job Managment"

Problem: Getting the status of a job
Features: "Job Managment"

Problem: Asking leadership what to work on
Features: "Messages"

Problem: Notification of work being done
Features: "Messages"

Features
-------------------------------------

* Job Management

   Tracks what people are working on.

* Priority Points

    Everyone can distribute their 100 priority points to the 
features they want.  It's important that everyone get's 100 
points.  It allows a person to realize that if they want a 
feature done, it is going to take resources away from other 
features.

* Follow Developers

    their actions show up in your feed
    their priority points for each issue are shown first

* Messages

    send messages to developers
    get notifications of activity, when work is done, if a PR 
needs to be reviewd

* Timeline

   can add dev time estimates

* ranking??
* track who's looking at what (if someone clicks on a link, it 
tracks that the link was clicked)
* add dependencies between jobs
* link a job to a PR
Jan 27 2015
prev sibling next sibling parent reply "Vladimir Panteleev" <vladimir thecybershadow.net> writes:
On Tuesday, 27 January 2015 at 18:10:10 UTC, Jonathan Marler 
wrote:

 Would people want and use a website that tracks who's working 
 on what in the D Programming Language?


Somewhat related, there's this page on the wiki:

http://wiki.dlang.org/People
Jan 27 2015
parent "Zach the Mystic" <reachzach gggmail.com> writes:
On Wednesday, 28 January 2015 at 00:21:58 UTC, Vladimir Panteleev 
wrote:

 On Tuesday, 27 January 2015 at 18:10:10 UTC, Jonathan Marler 
 wrote:

 Would people want and use a website that tracks who's working 
 on what in the D Programming Language?


 Somewhat related, there's this page on the wiki:

 http://wiki.dlang.org/People


I changed the section title "Articles on People" to "Bios and 
Information" because it seems friendlier.
Jan 28 2015
prev sibling next sibling parent "weaselcat" <weaselcat gmail.com> writes:
On Tuesday, 27 January 2015 at 18:10:10 UTC, Jonathan Marler 
wrote:

 Would people want and use a website that tracks who's working 
 on what in the D Programming Language?  People would go to the 
 site and be able to find out what's being worked on, what's not 
 being worked on, who's working on what, what bugs are being 
 worked on.  People will have to use the site and submit what 
 they are working on though.  I'd be willing to write such a 
 site if people think it would be useful.


I really like this idea. It's hard to figure out what's even 
being worked on without reviewing git.
Jan 27 2015
prev sibling parent reply "Dicebot" <public dicebot.lv> writes:
Before doing anything I'd suggest trying to reach main DMD/Phobos 
developers and ask them what kind of tools they feel lacking and 
what they would personally use. Such solution is only useful if 
it solves real problems of developers and thus is not viewed as 
additional maintenance burden. As Andrei has mentioned, there was 
one attempt of using Trello for similar purposed some time ago 
and it didn't catch up.

At the same time I do believe current project management 
facilities are lacking for internally and externally. During 
Berlin meetup Martin Nowak has mentioned that he would be 
interested in some sort of priority communication channel among 
core developers to be able to organize some focused efforts - I 
guess that is also something related.
Jan 27 2015
parent reply "Jonathan Marler" <johnnymarler gmail.com> writes:
On Wednesday, 28 January 2015 at 01:09:25 UTC, Dicebot wrote:

 Before doing anything I'd suggest trying to reach main 
 DMD/Phobos developers and ask them what kind of tools they feel 
 lacking and what they would personally use. Such solution is 
 only useful if it solves real problems of developers and thus 
 is not viewed as additional maintenance burden. As Andrei has 
 mentioned, there was one attempt of using Trello for similar 
 purposed some time ago and it didn't catch up.


Isn't that what this forum post is for?  To see what the core 
DMD/Phobos developers would like.  Is there another place to post 
this sort of question?


 At the same time I do believe current project management 
 facilities are lacking for internally and externally. During 
 Berlin meetup Martin Nowak has mentioned that he would be 
 interested in some sort of priority communication channel among 
 core developers to be able to organize some focused efforts - I 
 guess that is also something related.


Do you have some more details on what this priority communication 
would look like.  I can document it in my list of desirable 
features.
Jan 27 2015
parent reply "Dicebot" <public dicebot.lv> writes:
On Wednesday, 28 January 2015 at 04:05:10 UTC, Jonathan Marler 
wrote:

 On Wednesday, 28 January 2015 at 01:09:25 UTC, Dicebot wrote:

 Before doing anything I'd suggest trying to reach main 
 DMD/Phobos developers and ask them what kind of tools they 
 feel lacking and what they would personally use. Such solution 
 is only useful if it solves real problems of developers and 
 thus is not viewed as additional maintenance burden. As Andrei 
 has mentioned, there was one attempt of using Trello for 
 similar purposed some time ago and it didn't catch up.


 Isn't that what this forum post is for?  To see what the core 
 DMD/Phobos developers would like.  Is there another place to 
 post this sort of question?


Maybe it is worth duplicating to dmd-internals mail list and with 
CC to those who actively contribute to DMD. To be honest I don't 
even know who is currently in active D development team. In this 
thread I see Andrei and Vladimir but neither seem very 
enthusiastic.


 Do you have some more details on what this priority 
 communication would look like.  I can document it in my list of 
 desirable features.


It is better to ask Martin - I don't take part in any of those 
and have roughly as much understanding of the process as you do :)

But one thing that has occured to me is that we don't really need 
any complicated tool - just creating dedicated 
D-Programming-Language/bigpicture repo with issues enabled 
(editable only by core devs) and moving stuff from 
http://wiki.dlang.org/Agenda there in form of milestones and 
issues with link aggregation would be enough.

But, again, my opinion has zero value here.
Jan 28 2015
next sibling parent reply Andrei Alexandrescu <SeeWebsiteForEmail erdani.org> writes:
On 1/28/15 3:18 AM, Dicebot wrote:

 On Wednesday, 28 January 2015 at 04:05:10 UTC, Jonathan Marler wrote:

 On Wednesday, 28 January 2015 at 01:09:25 UTC, Dicebot wrote:

 Before doing anything I'd suggest trying to reach main DMD/Phobos
 developers and ask them what kind of tools they feel lacking and what
 they would personally use. Such solution is only useful if it solves
 real problems of developers and thus is not viewed as additional
 maintenance burden. As Andrei has mentioned, there was one attempt of
 using Trello for similar purposed some time ago and it didn't catch up.


 Isn't that what this forum post is for?  To see what the core
 DMD/Phobos developers would like.  Is there another place to post this
 sort of question?


 Maybe it is worth duplicating to dmd-internals mail list and with CC to
 those who actively contribute to DMD. To be honest I don't even know who
 is currently in active D development team.


Folks active on the github repo are pretty much it.


 In this thread I see Andrei and Vladimir but neither seem very
 enthusiastic.


For my money I do think we could gain a bit by organizing ourselves 
better, but not a lot. We have a problem of scarce resources more than 
one of resource allocation. D's issues and their relative importance are 
very well known. Framing it all as a matter of "these folks need better 
management" would be simplistic.

That said, high-level vision is always good to have and communicate. 
Also, whilst it's clear to the insiders what's going on, we need to 
better communicate what's happening. Adam's weekly newsletter is part of 
that, but we could do more.


 Do you have some more details on what this priority communication
 would look like.  I can document it in my list of desirable features.


 It is better to ask Martin - I don't take part in any of those and have
 roughly as much understanding of the process as you do :)

 But one thing that has occured to me is that we don't really need any
 complicated tool - just creating dedicated
 D-Programming-Language/bigpicture repo with issues enabled (editable
 only by core devs) and moving stuff from http://wiki.dlang.org/Agenda
 there in form of milestones and issues with link aggregation would be
 enough.


Yes, I think that would be useful.


 But, again, my opinion has zero value here.


Save it :o). I am very biased toward listening to people who contribute.


Andrei
Jan 28 2015
next sibling parent reply "Dicebot" <public dicebot.lv> writes:
On Wednesday, 28 January 2015 at 14:56:05 UTC, Andrei 
Alexandrescu wrote:

 But one thing that has occured to me is that we don't really 
 need any
 complicated tool - just creating dedicated
 D-Programming-Language/bigpicture repo with issues enabled 
 (editable
 only by core devs) and moving stuff from 
 http://wiki.dlang.org/Agenda
 there in form of milestones and issues with link aggregation 
 would be
 enough.


 Yes, I think that would be useful.


That also could be the meta-repo with submodules for other ones - 
I remember last time discussion stalled because no one actually 
took action. Will try hacking something this month for 
experiments.
Jan 28 2015
parent Andrei Alexandrescu <SeeWebsiteForEmail erdani.org> writes:
On 1/28/15 7:09 AM, Dicebot wrote:

 On Wednesday, 28 January 2015 at 14:56:05 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:

 But one thing that has occured to me is that we don't really need any
 complicated tool - just creating dedicated
 D-Programming-Language/bigpicture repo with issues enabled (editable
 only by core devs) and moving stuff from http://wiki.dlang.org/Agenda
 there in form of milestones and issues with link aggregation would be
 enough.


 Yes, I think that would be useful.


 That also could be the meta-repo with submodules for other ones - I
 remember last time discussion stalled because no one actually took
 action. Will try hacking something this month for experiments.


Thanks! -- Andrei
Jan 28 2015
prev sibling parent reply "Daniel Murphy" <yebbliesnospam gmail.com> writes:
"Andrei Alexandrescu"  wrote in message 
news:maata5$1cpr$1 digitalmars.com...


 That said, high-level vision is always good to have and communicate. Also, 
 whilst it's clear to the insiders what's going on, we need to better 
 communicate what's happening. Adam's weekly newsletter is part of that, 
 but we could do more.


The best tool we've ever had for this is dconf.  I wish we could afford to 
do it every few months.
Jan 28 2015
parent reply Andrei Alexandrescu <SeeWebsiteForEmail erdani.org> writes:
On 1/28/15 8:32 AM, Daniel Murphy wrote:

 "Andrei Alexandrescu"  wrote in message
 news:maata5$1cpr$1 digitalmars.com...


 That said, high-level vision is always good to have and communicate.
 Also, whilst it's clear to the insiders what's going on, we need to
 better communicate what's happening. Adam's weekly newsletter is part
 of that, but we could do more.


 The best tool we've ever had for this is dconf.  I wish we could afford
 to do it every few months.


BTW I think your submission got lost in the mail. Please resend. -- Andrei
Jan 28 2015
parent "Daniel Murphy" <yebbliesnospam gmail.com> writes:
"Andrei Alexandrescu"  wrote in message 
news:mab3ba$1ipq$1 digitalmars.com...


 BTW I think your submission got lost in the mail. Please resend. -- Andrei


I still have 29 days!
Jan 28 2015
prev sibling parent "aldanor" <i.s.smirnov gmail.com> writes:
On Wednesday, 28 January 2015 at 11:18:46 UTC, Dicebot wrote:

 Maybe it is worth duplicating to dmd-internals mail list and 
 with CC to those who actively contribute to DMD. To be honest I 
 don't even know who is currently in active D development team. 
 In this thread I see Andrei and Vladimir but neither seem very 
 enthusiastic.


Why not use #d-internals instead on IRC + searchable botbot.me 
logs for communication and brainstorming?
Jan 28 2015