digitalmars.D - Elephant is open source
- Tom (4/4) Dec 14 2005 I just realize the good news. If anyone is interested in having a nice D...
- Charles (11/15) Dec 14 2005 Actually im no longer developing elephant , but Im going to try to start...
- Tom (37/51) Dec 14 2005 I'm not THAT pretentious about IDEs. The fact that I can compile and run...
- Shawn_Liu (7/10) Dec 15 2005 I have written something from scratch with DWT, the Poseidon editor for ...
- Charles (15/26) Dec 16 2005 Hey Shawn,
- J C Calvarese (3/7) Dec 16 2005 Does this count? http://svn.dsource.org/projects/dbug/trunk/src/dparser/...
- Charles (6/15) Dec 16 2005 Good call!
- Tom (11/42) Dec 16 2005 It comes to me, maybe what I'm going to say is very stupid, but I'm will...
- Sean Kelly (6/23) Dec 16 2005 I think this is one reason Walter has made the DMD front-end freely
- Charles (12/35) Dec 16 2005 Unfortunately its not designed to be used other than in 'batch' mode , a...
- Sean Kelly (5/9) Dec 16 2005 Yeah, I wondered about that. I scanned the code one and turned up maybe...
- Hasan Aljudy (17/85) Dec 16 2005 I've thought about that, but I was thinking more of writing another
- Tom (6/91) Dec 16 2005 That's not what I'm saying. I'm not asking someone to extend DMD parser,...
- Chris Sauls (4/19) Dec 18 2005 Would an XML format output from DDoc be enough? Or is there some inform...
- Tom (6/24) Dec 18 2005 Currently I see one mayor impossibility that makes Ddoc useless for the ...
- John Reimer (5/16) Dec 16 2005 I remember Kris talking about the advantages of porting JFace to D also....
- Charles (13/30) Dec 19 2005 Yea I spent the weekend trying to learn eclipse, and im totally sold ( ...
- John Reimer (17/28) Dec 19 2005 Interesting about SWT GUI Builders. I hadn't investigated/played with
- Shawn Liu (8/15) Dec 20 2005 The most powerful GUI builder for SWT may be "WindowBuilder" from
- Derek Parnell (10/11) Dec 14 2005 Well actually its not so open; it's written in C++ using MFC, so its sti...
- Tom (2/13) Dec 14 2005
- Lionello Lunesu (12/16) Dec 15 2005 Then 'they' should consider porting it to WTL, www.sf.net/projects/wtl
I just realize the good news. If anyone is interested in having a nice D-IDE (like me), this is definitely the way to go! Wish I had more time to take active part of it (I'll try to make some). Tom
Dec 14 2005
Actually im no longer developing elephant , but Im going to try to start a new community IDE built with DWT , so if you have any thoughts on your ideal IDE please share them! My only fear is that it will come out too much like eclipse -- and actually im still on the fence, there are so many IDE's out there already is really worth it ? I personally dont use IDE's. Charlie "Tom" <Tom_member pathlink.com> wrote in message news:dnq7be$1uqm$1 digitaldaemon.com...I just realize the good news. If anyone is interested in having a niceD-IDE(like me), this is definitely the way to go! Wish I had more time to takeactivepart of it (I'll try to make some). Tom
Dec 14 2005
Don't you? In article <dnq9ui$20ss$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...Actually im no longer developing elephant , but Im going to try to start a new community IDE built with DWT , so if you have any thoughts on your ideal IDE please share them!I'm not THAT pretentious about IDEs. The fact that I can compile and run from the same enviroment is enough to me (at first). Also a good intelisense is very useful once in a while but not indispensable IMO. Visual Studio .NET is nice (as an IDE), ECLIPSE is also great IDE (and much more featured just for Java) but its "toys" aren't that important as the basics I've just mentioned above. If you let me, I'll tell you (with all my respect) what I think about Elephant, it's very nice (that all we know, as a promise at least) but you shouldn't have to put on it so many incomplete features. If I was to make an IDE, first I'll do the few important features (ie compiling and running, displaying errors, syntax highlighting, project files). I wouldn't have done intelisense nor macros nor any other too detailed feature. So it would be relatively easy to mantain at first. Then you would enhance it step by step, slowly. Correcting bugs and adding little features to it in the long term. Obviously this would require a good and flexible design (to not having to redesign everything on the way), and that I know, it's all but an easy job. Your second "mistake" (do not take it as it sounds) was to use MFC: Oh My God I hate it!, it's so ugly and confusing and .... uuuhh .... I don't like it at all :D But maybe you master it so much to trust it for the purpose, so I can't really judge you on this field. If you ask me, I would code it in D, but I don't really know if this is such an easy task (I don't know how mature/complete are the D obviously I don't know if linux/FreeBSD fans would like it that much :), I am Windows/FreeBSD user, in unix I use VI and in Windows an IDE (when possible) or a TextEditor.My only fear is that it will come out too much like eclipse -- and actually im still on the fence, there are so many IDE's out there already is really worth it ? I personally dont use IDE's.I thought you said you were trying to open an IDE community for coding it in D with DWT. I see you aren't that sure yet. Am I missing something?! :) I would be glad to help you if you let me, but I can't promise my total devotion to a project since I work and "study" ;) (I'm a busy guy :P), and sometimes personal projects distract me too much. I'm never going to complete my degree at this step :P Anyway, I'll support you in any path you take and I'll help in anything I can. Good Luck TomCharlie "Tom" <Tom_member pathlink.com> wrote in message news:dnq7be$1uqm$1 digitaldaemon.com...I just realize the good news. If anyone is interested in having a niceD-IDE(like me), this is definitely the way to go! Wish I had more time to takeactivepart of it (I'll try to make some).
Dec 14 2005
In article <dnq9ui$20ss$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...Actually im no longer developing elephant , but Im going to try to start a new community IDE built with DWT , so if you have any thoughts on your ideal IDE please share them!I have written something from scratch with DWT, the Poseidon editor for D. It can be shipped out in days. The main purpose of Poseidon is to test DWT but not intend to be an IDE since the feature is thin and weak. By develope Poseidon, I found and fixed some bugs in DWT. If you plan to write an IDE using DWT, I can provide help. DWT needs a comparative complex application to test and check. Thanks.
Dec 15 2005
Hey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done this ? ). I've also decided to try to make a GUI builder for DWT -- just as a personal project -- but I could defintly use your input on it. Ill start posting on DWT forum. Charlie "Shawn_Liu" <Shawn_Liu_member pathlink.com> wrote in message news:dnt6vb$11cu$1 digitaldaemon.com...In article <dnq9ui$20ss$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...aActually im no longer developing elephant , but Im going to try to startidealnew community IDE built with DWT , so if you have any thoughts on yourItIDE please share them!I have written something from scratch with DWT, the Poseidon editor for D.can be shipped out in days. The main purpose of Poseidon is to test DWTbut notintend to be an IDE since the feature is thin and weak. By developePoseidon, Ifound and fixed some bugs in DWT. If you plan to write an IDE using DWT, I can provide help. DWT needs a comparative complex application to test and check. Thanks.
Dec 16 2005
In article <dnulsn$280g$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...Hey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done this ? ).Does this count? http://svn.dsource.org/projects/dbug/trunk/src/dparser/parse.d jcc7
Dec 16 2005
Good call! Charlie "J C Calvarese" <technocrat7 gmail.com> wrote in message news:dnuveb$2f86$1 digitaldaemon.com...In article <dnulsn$280g$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...? ).Hey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done thisDoes this count?http://svn.dsource.org/projects/dbug/trunk/src/dparser/parse.djcc7
Dec 16 2005
In article <dnulsn$280g$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...Hey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done this ? ).It comes to me, maybe what I'm going to say is very stupid, but I'm willing to take the risk :) What about if the compiler had a mode (option or whatever) to compile and generate parsing information ideal for an editor/intelisense engine? I suppose this doesn't exist for D or it would have been used yet. What could be the problems with this approach? The advantages are a lot. The editor wouldn't have to repeat work that the compiler had already done (parsing) and to update an editor on a language change would be also "trivial". Any ideas or thougths??I've also decided to try to make a GUI builder for DWT -- just as a personal project -- but I could defintly use your input on it. Ill start posting on DWT forum. Charlie "Shawn_Liu" <Shawn_Liu_member pathlink.com> wrote in message news:dnt6vb$11cu$1 digitaldaemon.com...Tom;In article <dnq9ui$20ss$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...aActually im no longer developing elephant , but Im going to try to startidealnew community IDE built with DWT , so if you have any thoughts on yourItIDE please share them!I have written something from scratch with DWT, the Poseidon editor for D.can be shipped out in days. The main purpose of Poseidon is to test DWTbut notintend to be an IDE since the feature is thin and weak. By developePoseidon, Ifound and fixed some bugs in DWT. If you plan to write an IDE using DWT, I can provide help. DWT needs a comparative complex application to test and check. Thanks.
Dec 16 2005
Tom wrote:In article <dnulsn$280g$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...I think this is one reason Walter has made the DMD front-end freely available. It shouldn't be too terribly difficult to tie the lexer (and the parser, if you want to do more than code coloring) into an editor. The front-end is even already designed to operate on an in-memory buffer. SeanHey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done this ? ).It comes to me, maybe what I'm going to say is very stupid, but I'm willing to take the risk :) What about if the compiler had a mode (option or whatever) to compile and generate parsing information ideal for an editor/intelisense engine? I suppose this doesn't exist for D or it would have been used yet. What could be the problems with this approach? The advantages are a lot. The editor wouldn't have to repeat work that the compiler had already done (parsing) and to update an editor on a language change would be also "trivial".
Dec 16 2005
Unfortunately its not designed to be used other than in 'batch' mode , alot of the heap allocations rely on the program ending to be free'd , making it leak memory when calling Module::parse() more than once -- but it is a great source none the less. "Sean Kelly" <sean f4.ca> wrote in message news:dnv7hp$2l3v$2 digitaldaemon.com...Tom wrote:? ).In article <dnulsn$280g$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...Hey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done thiswilling toIt comes to me, maybe what I'm going to say is very stupid, but I'mandtake the risk :) What about if the compiler had a mode (option or whatever) to compilesupposegenerate parsing information ideal for an editor/intelisense engine? IThethis doesn't exist for D or it would have been used yet. What could be the problems with this approach? The advantages are a lot.(parsing)editor wouldn't have to repeat work that the compiler had already doneand to update an editor on a language change would be also "trivial".I think this is one reason Walter has made the DMD front-end freely available. It shouldn't be too terribly difficult to tie the lexer (and the parser, if you want to do more than code coloring) into an editor. The front-end is even already designed to operate on an in-memory buffer. Sean
Dec 16 2005
Charles wrote:Unfortunately its not designed to be used other than in 'batch' mode , alot of the heap allocations rely on the program ending to be free'd , making it leak memory when calling Module::parse() more than once -- but it is a great source none the less.Yeah, I wondered about that. I scanned the code one and turned up maybe two "delete" calls. You could always use it with the Boehm GC. I know the allocator calls already go through a class wrapper. Sean
Dec 16 2005
Tom wrote:In article <dnulsn$280g$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...I've thought about that, but I was thinking more of writing another parser (not the one in dmd), because it seems to me that that dmd front-end is not designed to be used outside the compiler, it's not really extendable. Alas I don't have any experience implementing compilers! I did try it once (parsing) in java, and had some success parsing DeclDefs, I even added a hack to it to make generate header-like files, but it wasn't tested much, and I don't think anyone tried/tested/used it. Now I'm thinking about doing it in D, but I'm a very lazy kinda guy! Lexing is trivial, I did it before I knew what regular expressions were!! Parsing .. not so easy! Although I have a rough idea of what I need to do, but it just seems complicated & lots of work. The BlackBird eclipse editor plugin can parse .d files and figure out all the declarations, the it uses antlr (which is written in java), but I don't really what it is and/or how it works!! Maybe someone could port the whole thing to D?Hey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done this ? ).It comes to me, maybe what I'm going to say is very stupid, but I'm willing to take the risk :) What about if the compiler had a mode (option or whatever) to compile and generate parsing information ideal for an editor/intelisense engine? I suppose this doesn't exist for D or it would have been used yet. What could be the problems with this approach? The advantages are a lot. The editor wouldn't have to repeat work that the compiler had already done (parsing) and to update an editor on a language change would be also "trivial". Any ideas or thougths??I've also decided to try to make a GUI builder for DWT -- just as a personal project -- but I could defintly use your input on it. Ill start posting on DWT forum. Charlie "Shawn_Liu" <Shawn_Liu_member pathlink.com> wrote in message news:dnt6vb$11cu$1 digitaldaemon.com...Tom;In article <dnq9ui$20ss$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...aActually im no longer developing elephant , but Im going to try to startidealnew community IDE built with DWT , so if you have any thoughts on yourItIDE please share them!I have written something from scratch with DWT, the Poseidon editor for D.can be shipped out in days. The main purpose of Poseidon is to test DWTbut notintend to be an IDE since the feature is thin and weak. By developePoseidon, Ifound and fixed some bugs in DWT. If you plan to write an IDE using DWT, I can provide help. DWT needs a comparative complex application to test and check. Thanks.
Dec 16 2005
In article <dnvkc8$2u0g$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Hasan Aljudy says...Tom wrote:That's not what I'm saying. I'm not asking someone to extend DMD parser, I'm thinking about what about if Walter could extend DMD to generate an output file with some easy format with the parsed info. This way a D editor have a lot less work to do and could stay more independent from language changes.In article <dnulsn$280g$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...I've thought about that, but I was thinking more of writing another parser (not the one in dmd), because it seems to me that that dmd front-end is not designed to be used outside the compiler, it's not really extendable.Hey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done this ? ).It comes to me, maybe what I'm going to say is very stupid, but I'm willing to take the risk :) What about if the compiler had a mode (option or whatever) to compile and generate parsing information ideal for an editor/intelisense engine? I suppose this doesn't exist for D or it would have been used yet. What could be the problems with this approach? The advantages are a lot. The editor wouldn't have to repeat work that the compiler had already done (parsing) and to update an editor on a language change would be also "trivial". Any ideas or thougths??Alas I don't have any experience implementing compilers! I did try it once (parsing) in java, and had some success parsing DeclDefs, I even added a hack to it to make generate header-like files, but it wasn't tested much, and I don't think anyone tried/tested/used it. Now I'm thinking about doing it in D, but I'm a very lazy kinda guy! Lexing is trivial, I did it before I knew what regular expressions were!! Parsing .. not so easy! Although I have a rough idea of what I need to do, but it just seems complicated & lots of work. The BlackBird eclipse editor plugin can parse .d files and figure out all the declarations, the it uses antlr (which is written in java), but I don't really what it is and/or how it works!! Maybe someone could port the whole thing to D?TomI've also decided to try to make a GUI builder for DWT -- just as a personal project -- but I could defintly use your input on it. Ill start posting on DWT forum. Charlie "Shawn_Liu" <Shawn_Liu_member pathlink.com> wrote in message news:dnt6vb$11cu$1 digitaldaemon.com...Tom;In article <dnq9ui$20ss$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...aActually im no longer developing elephant , but Im going to try to startidealnew community IDE built with DWT , so if you have any thoughts on yourItIDE please share them!I have written something from scratch with DWT, the Poseidon editor for D.can be shipped out in days. The main purpose of Poseidon is to test DWTbut notintend to be an IDE since the feature is thin and weak. By developePoseidon, Ifound and fixed some bugs in DWT. If you plan to write an IDE using DWT, I can provide help. DWT needs a comparative complex application to test and check. Thanks.
Dec 16 2005
Tom wrote:In article <dnulsn$280g$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...Would an XML format output from DDoc be enough? Or is there some information that DDoc doesn't output that would be neccessary? -- Chris SaulsHey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done this ? ).It comes to me, maybe what I'm going to say is very stupid, but I'm willing to take the risk :) What about if the compiler had a mode (option or whatever) to compile and generate parsing information ideal for an editor/intelisense engine? I suppose this doesn't exist for D or it would have been used yet.
Dec 18 2005
In article <do4kvt$1j2$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Chris Sauls says...Tom wrote:Currently I see one mayor impossibility that makes Ddoc useless for the task: *when compiling with -D if the compiler fails to compile (because of an error), it doesn't generate the doc file*. An XML format is a great idea (if the above weren't an impediment). TomIn article <dnulsn$280g$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Charles says...Would an XML format output from DDoc be enough? Or is there some information that DDoc doesn't output that would be neccessary?Hey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done this ? ).It comes to me, maybe what I'm going to say is very stupid, but I'm willing to take the risk :) What about if the compiler had a mode (option or whatever) to compile and generate parsing information ideal for an editor/intelisense engine? I suppose this doesn't exist for D or it would have been used yet.
Dec 18 2005
Charles wrote:Hey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done this ? ). I've also decided to try to make a GUI builder for DWT -- just as a personal project -- but I could defintly use your input on it. Ill start posting on DWT forum. CharlieI remember Kris talking about the advantages of porting JFace to D also. I believe it makes it easy to build GUI's with SWT. Maybe that would be something to look into again? -JJR
Dec 16 2005
Yea I spent the weekend trying to learn eclipse, and im totally sold ( on eclipse ). There are several GUI builders already for SWT, including Eclipse's visual editor project ( http://www.eclipse.org/vep/ ) , which is actually a generic gui builder that can generate code for several toolkits, which already supports SWT, so DWT should be doable with not much work, pretty cool! Can't wait to try the blackbird plugin ( for D ) , the PHP plugin pwns :D. Charlie "John Reimer" <terminal.node gmail.com> wrote in message news:dnv5oh$2joo$1 digitaldaemon.com...Charles wrote:? ).Hey Shawn, Cool on the IDE! I imagine if your put the code on SVN people will be willing to help, I could add intellisense if you like , I plan on translating parse.c from DMD to D (Unless someone has already done thispersonalI've also decided to try to make a GUI builder for DWT -- just as aonproject -- but I could defintly use your input on it. Ill start postingDWT forum. CharlieI remember Kris talking about the advantages of porting JFace to D also. I believe it makes it easy to build GUI's with SWT. Maybe that would be something to look into again? -JJR
Dec 19 2005
Charles wrote:Yea I spent the weekend trying to learn eclipse, and im totally sold ( on eclipse ). There are several GUI builders already for SWT, including Eclipse's visual editor project ( http://www.eclipse.org/vep/ ) , which is actually a generic gui builder that can generate code for several toolkits, which already supports SWT, so DWT should be doable with not much work, pretty cool! Can't wait to try the blackbird plugin ( for D ) , the PHP plugin pwns :D. CharlieInteresting about SWT GUI Builders. I hadn't investigated/played with any of those. It would be wonderful to have equivalent solutions for D, for certain. I think the ultimate project would be to port the complete Eclipse over to D. I'm sure there would be a huge performance improvement :). Although that might be overkill for a project, since it's already working well in Java. Blackbird plugin is no longer available as it was; although you might be able to find the last version lying around. As I understand it, blackbird got folded into the current EclipseD/DDT project at dsource.org which is supposed to going the more complete integration route. I still haven't got it working, though. I just wish DDT had a method to easily install it in Eclipse. I haven't figured out how to get it working despite previous discussions here about pointing Eclipse to the correct DDT plugin site location. Blackbird, even in its minimal state, was excellent, indeed. -JJR
Dec 19 2005
"Charles" <noone nowhere.com> says:do6hr1$far$1 digitaldaemon.com...Yea I spent the weekend trying to learn eclipse, and im totally sold ( on eclipse ). There are several GUI builders already for SWT, including Eclipse's visual editor project ( http://www.eclipse.org/vep/ ) , which is actually a generic gui builder that can generate code for several toolkits, which already supports SWT, so DWT should be doable with not much work, pretty cool!The most powerful GUI builder for SWT may be "WindowBuilder" from http://www.Instantiations.com. The alterative may be "Jigloo GUI Builder" from http://www.cloudgarden.com/jigloo/. And it's free for non-commercial use. VE currently is not as visual as it should be. - Shawn
Dec 20 2005
On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 22:46:07 +0000 (UTC), Tom wrote:I just realize the good news.Well actually its not so open; it's written in C++ using MFC, so its still pretty 'closed' ;-) -- Derek (skype: derek.j.parnell) Melbourne, Australia "A learning experience is one of those things that says, 'You know that thing you just did? Don't do that.'" - D.N. Adams 15/12/2005 10:49:38 AM
Dec 14 2005
In article <6zera4b3m2wa.144yfqhr2vd3l.dlg 40tude.net>, Derek Parnell says...On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 22:46:07 +0000 (UTC), Tom wrote:Hehe, I agree ;-)I just realize the good news.Well actually its not so open; it's written in C++ using MFC, so its still pretty 'closed' ;-)-- Derek (skype: derek.j.parnell) Melbourne, Australia "A learning experience is one of those things that says, 'You know that thing you just did? Don't do that.'" - D.N. Adams 15/12/2005 10:49:38 AM
Dec 14 2005
"Derek Parnell" <derek psych.ward> wrote in message news:6zera4b3m2wa.144yfqhr2vd3l.dlg 40tude.net...On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 22:46:07 +0000 (UTC), Tom wrote:Then 'they' should consider porting it to WTL, www.sf.net/projects/wtl It's open source, although I think it might need ATL, which comes with MFC :-( In any case, it's much more straightforward, and doesn't attempt to be 'smart' like MFC. It just wraps the Win32 API and uses RAII, which is the only point of having a C++ GUI framework, I think. I've done this to my own MFC projects as well (I used MFC when started programming GUIs in C++, I've used Delphi before that, so forgive me!) and porting MFC projects to WTL is really straightforward, mostly renames. L.I just realize the good news.Well actually its not so open; it's written in C++ using MFC, so its still pretty 'closed' ;-)
Dec 15 2005